Wired That Way: Understanding Personality to Transform Your Relationships

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0:44 Denzel Washington, welcome to inspire Vision. Our sole purpose is to elevate the lives of others and to inspire you. To do the same. Marita, welcome to the show. Thank you so much. It's a treat to be with you again. I love that we get to follow up from our previous. Yeah, it's always nice. So so many times we get into a topic and we're going and going and realizing we're out of time and there's so much more that we want to talk about. So just update the audience again. Who you are a little bit about your background, the book that you wrote, not getting into the book itself, and then also share with the audience, kind of update them and help them to remember what we have been talking about.

1:24 Certainly, and I hope if someone listens tonight that didn't listen to the previous edition, that they'll go back and listen. To that episode as well. So I'm my name is Marita Littower, and I am the author of twenty books, but the one we're mostly talking about is this one. Wired that Way and here in twenty twenty six is the twentieth anniversary of this book, and basically this book deals with how we are wired, specifically having to do with personality pipes. And throughout this book we addressed the four basic personality types and how they impact our own lives, but escally how they impact our relationships with others, because that's the real thing that I find that is different from the approach that I take to this general topic, this general body of work from what some others might be familiar with.

2:20 Out there, Okay, good, good, good good, And talk a little bit about what what did we talk about last time? Just kind of update the audience on that sure, well, we. Get an overview of the four basic personality types I talk about that I want to just state up front. Then, of course we're not putting anyone in a box. While there are four basic personality types, very few of us are uniquely one personality type. Most of us have a variation of personality types. And it's much like a color wheel. We may have a certain ratio of one and a little bit of another, or we may be closer to But once you understand the general concepts, you understand what your personality type is, and then you begin to be able to identify the personality type of other people. You can adjust your approach to them, you can adjust your expectations of them, and you can ultimately meet their emotional needs, which is one of the key things we did not get to talk about in our previous episode.

3:27 Okay, and so let's let's get into that a little bit. And I know that you have you have some very specific names for your different personalities. I use an entirely different UH concept, but it's the same thing. It's the same thing. I think a lot of people are more familiar with the disc the D I, S C. Yours are for the deals one. Of the other major popular systems. Yeah. But anyway, so as we talk about that, let's let's talk about what what seems to be in your opinion and your experience. What are the major issues in a relationship that cause conflict and misunderstanding and sometimes a tremendous amount of frustration.

4:13 I think one of the key things is that most of us were raised on what we called the Golden rule, which says, do unto others as you would have them do unto you. We acknowledge that there are people out there who are different from us. When I speak on this topic, I always start by asking my audience how many of you have noticed there are people out there who are different from you? And they all, of course raise their hands, And I say, how many of you live with, work with. Or used to live with that person who's different from you? And they all raise their hands, And then I ask how often have you tried to change that person?

4:53 And has it ever worked? And by now they're with me, and they all respond never, never were that. We may try to change those people to make them more like us, but they are wired that way. They are hardwired. That personality comes with us, inborn and in fact. Again, when I'm dealing with an audience and I ask, I usually speak to women's groups, because of course I'm a female, and so I tend to speak to women's groups. And I'll ask, how many. Of you out there are mothers of more than one child? Most of the audience is, and I'll say, could you tell in the womb that child number two was different from child number one? And they all respond, yes, they could tell. You can bring up two children the same household, with the same parents, perhaps the same bedroom and the same clothes, and yet they come out to be very different people.

5:46 So they come out different. And you know, you talk about the fact that they come out wired differently. Why do you think that is? Well, I think that's the way God made us. The world will be very boring if we were all identical and the same, and we have different skills, we have different strains, and that makes this good in one area where another person is good in a different area. And I mentioned at the beginning of that segment there that we were raised on what we call the golden rule, and that applies here in that while we acknowledge people are different, we don't stop to think about how they're different and what we need to do differently. And so because I'm a certain way, do unto others as you would have them do unto do. I tend to give people what I want, and what I want is different from what they want based on their basic personality. And so you asked me, what do you think is the biggest problem in relationships today? And that's what I think is the biggest problem in in close relationships. I'm not talking about the United States versus a rain or whatever that kind of relationship. I'm talking about relationshipships with people that we care enough about to step outside of who we are and look at what is it this person needs from me?

7:10 Because I want to have. A good relationship with my steps, I want to have a good relationship with my friends. I want to have a good relationship with the people. I work with, those people who are in my world, I want to have a good relationship with them, and a big part of that takes being able to step back and look at who they are, how they operate, and what they need, and then being able to care enough about them to provide that to them, to adjust my expectations and give them what they need. Okay, so you talk about a couple of things, and I think one is how do they communicate? Number one? Number two how do they want to be communicated too?

7:55 And number three? And you talk about needs, and I find that interest to share a little bit more, and then we'll get back to the other stuff. When you talk about needs, what are you talking about? I mean, we all have needs, but and some are very similar. But what are the differentials in personalities relative. To the needs that they have, at least in your experience. Yeah, well, let me back up if I could, because we covered this last time. But for our people who are joining us new tonight, for today, whenever they're listening, is that each personality type, there's four basic personality types, and I'm just going to run through those real quickly. I've got a little hand out here because you were mentioning needs, so I was trying to find my little handout that addresses that. So we have what I call the popular sanguine personality, represented by the color yellow, and that is the fun, loving, outgoing kind of personality. It's the one who never met a stranger. But along with that, some of the corresponding weaknesses tend to be organization, lack of scheduling, talking too loud, not being aware of others in the conversation, and monopolizing the conversation.

9:09 So that's what we. Call the popular sanguine personality. And let me just mention that word sanguine, that you go home, what is she talking about? That's a Greek word that was created or originated by the great Greek thinker Hippocrates more than two thousand years ago, when he first observed that people were different. And he's really the father of these concepts. Over the years, they've been added to and modernized, but he's really the father of them. And so the funny sounding. Word is one of those Greek words that Hippocrates came up with. Because that doesn't mean anything to most people, I've added to it a modern day adjective such as popular.

9:51 And I add to it a color. And as I always tell people, you mentioned Doug, you're familiar more with disc that's fine. I tell people not about labels. It's about relationships. So if you're familiar with a different system, as I go along, just kind of translate as we go. So I like to start with the popular seguine. Then I go to the opposite, which is the perfect melancholy personality represented by the color blue, because that's the person who is deep, thoughtful, introspective. They tend to be a perfectionist. As a negative of that, however, they tend to expect perfectionism from other people and they don't. If they're not wired that way, they're not going to be that.

10:33 Therefore, they tend to be disappointed in relationships more easily, and they tend to be boody and depressed more than any of the other kinds of personalities. Next, we'll go to the. Powerful color represented by the color red, and that's the strong, driven, goal oriented kind of person the natural boss of life. Now, on the flip side of that, they tend to be bossy. They tend to be judgmental, and because they've typically grown up being right, they have a very hard time apologizing when they're wrong. Opposite that, opposite of that, represented by the colored green is the peaceful, plegmatic personality, and that's the watcher of life. That's the person who's in the background.

11:20 It's the one if you said to them, would you like coffee or tea? They're going to say it doesn't matter, whichever is easiest, and truly they don't really care. Now, this person the peaceful plegmatic. On the rare occasions that they voice an opinion, you better pay attention because when they do voice an opinion, they mean it strongly, and some people as a result, think they can be very stubborn, which confuses people sometimes in watching them with the peaceful phlegmatic green being stubborn and the powerful colored red being controlling. But when you understand where it's coming from, it makes sense. Okay, So let's also define for people, because I know a lot of people are aware of left brain, right brain, extrovert, introvert?

12:06 Are are you able to take those? And kind of shuare what those are? Yeah? Basically, the top two are the extrovert and they're also the hot personalities, and that's why they are the hot colors. The bottom two are the introverts and hence the cool colors. They prefer to stay in the background. These people prefer to be out front, in charge. Over here on this side, the yellow and the green, the people of flegmatics are in the popular sanguine tend to be the more creative types, although again this is sometimes confusing for people because both the popular sanguine and the perfect Melancholy can be very creative.

12:49 It's different. They can be artistic and musical. The perfect Melancholy tends to be musical more like mastering the craft. They want to learn the piece perfectly, where the popular sanguine wings it for and so they're more They're the more creative in that way, where these two here are more business focused. As a combination, person, I like to say this combination the powerful choleric and the perfect Melancholy combined, which I would. Guess is what you probably are. Is this combination, I'd like to say that this is corporate America's favorite person because this is the person who becomes the workaholic. This is the person who can take charge of a project and.

13:37 Go forth with it and do it really well. Where this combination, I like to say, is everyone's favorite person because they have the fun loving nature and the easy going nature which makes them a good friend but not so much a great worker. Okay, so you talk about needs, Now, when what do you define by nees? And you know, how how is that? How is that yellow? What are their needs versus the you know, the red. Perfect melancholy, which is the opposite. Yeah, so the popular sague has emotional needs that come prepackaged, and we need attention and approval. That's part of why we dress like we do because we want to be noticed.

14:22 We want people to see that we're there, and we also want people to love us. Hug us, kiss us, touch us, and tell us that we are wondering. We don't necessarily want to have done anything to get that approval, but we just want to be loved, hug kissed, and touched. Now, the perfect melancholy on the opposite of that, the perfect melancholy needs sensitivity and space. So the perfect melancholy And we haven't gotten to this part yet, but it's appropriate to mention now, we tend to marry someone who is opposite from us, and we may or may not marry, but you know, in a long term relationship, we tend and actually be attracted to someone who's opposite from us because we see in that person, even though it maybe isn't conscious, but we see in that person something we know we are lacking in ourselves. So for me being the popular sang, but I'm the top two, but I'm a little more of the popular segment depending on the role that I'm playing. But you know where I am in life is what I mean by the role I'm playing.

15:24 But I'm married to someone who is perfect melancholy. He's a CPA, he's quiet way, he gives me a lot of one word answers, and I talk to me he says, I'm a man of few words, and it's like, yeah, I know that, but could you just tell me I did a good job, you know. And so we tend to have an opposite because inherent in the perfect melancholy. And again this is not always a conscious thought until someone hears someone like me talk about it and they go, oh, yeah, but the perfect melancholy they expect excuse me, they expect perfect Now, I'm not ever going to be perfect enough on my own. I'm just not ever gonna be perfect enough.

16:04 And subconsciously, this person thinks if I tell this person that they're good, they're gonna think this level of work is acceptable. And it's not acceptable. It's not quite good enough. It's better maybe the. Last week, but it's not quite good enough. And you see that maybe more in a work situation, but it happens in a marriage as well. And I'm sure you've seen. As I have marriages where the man who's married to let's say, the man is the perfect melancho, and he's married to the popular seguine, and she's kind of the cheerleader. She's the cute, bubbly one, and everybody loves her. She forgets to make dinner, she gets home late, she forgets to go do whatever. You know, she just forgets. And we've all seen this. The perfect melancholy man who's a lawyer day, he's whatever, a very precise kind of individual, and he leaves her for his secretary. And the same secretary is kind of unattractive. I mean, this happened in my own family. The secretary is kind of unattractive, and those of us looking in from the outside, we go, what made him get.

17:11 Rid of her? For her? I mean, you're probably roughly my age at least, so you'll relate to this. Our audience may or may not. But when King Charles, well he wasn't king then. But when Charles left Diana for Camilla, I know, they were just in the United States this week, so it's very error. When this airs, it'll be last month. But they were just here and you look at her and you think of Diana, and you're like what was he thinking to. Leave her for her? Well, chances are. She met his emotional needs where the popular sanguine personality long ago gave up trying to meet him, trying to meet his needs and went often did her own thing.

17:52 And that's what very often happens. It's a similar story with this company. But I've kind of went off on a marriage tangent that you didn't really ask about. But now I don't even know what your question was. But that is what you're talking about, emotional needs. That's where we were. So the perfect melancholy needs sensitivity in space. Well, you've got to sit with the perfect melancholy if you want to say to them, I'm a popular saying when married to a perfect melancholy, that's the norm. And I say, how is your day? And what's he going to say? Okay, yeah, And I'm not going to get more out of him unless I slow down, I quiet down, and I sit down, and I sit there with him, and I don't necessarily say anything.

18:38 I give him sensitivity and I give him space. Maybe I reach out and hold his hand and say, you know, what looks like something's really bothering you today? Did something happened bad now. He may have said everything was fine earlier. But when I slow down, quiet down, and sit down, then when I give him the sensitivity and space that he needs. Now, my husband that I'm married to now, and it is my second marriage. He's these two. He's a CPA, but he's also the low key background that I have for years in my speeches, been telling people, if you're married to a peaceful plegmatic, he needs respect and a feeling of self worth. His batteries are drained by t people. Both of these are so my husband is the combination brained by people. And I've been saying to people, if you're married to a peaceful plegmatic. When he comes home, he literally needs thirty minutes in the recliner. Now, remember he's probably married to the powerful cooler, the worker of life. And if they don't understand this, when he walks in the door, he's going to say to him, I need you to take out the trash, Donnie needs help with his homework, you know, and so forth, whatever the story might be. And he's going to feel overwhelmed because he needs that thirty minutes in the recliner to recharge his batteries. One day, I was going to go speak on this topic early in my husband's and I married, not early early, we've been married eleven and a half years now, but fairly early in our marriage. And I

20:10 was going to go speak on this topic. And before I was going to go speak on it, he said to me, And I'm his third wife. He's my second husband, he said to me, he. Said, you are my first the first wife who has ever understood me. Now, to me, that's relationship gold, That's what this whole thing is about. Because I understood that he needs to sit in the recliner. And fortunately he's a very good man. He's responsible, he mows the lawn when it needs to me mode I don't have to nag him things like that. But this is where relationships have problems because unless we understand the need that come prepackaged with that person, we tend to give them what we want rather than what they want. I know that was a really long answer, but I hope it answered.

20:57 Your question well. And I think that's so important to stand And I appreciate you going that, you know far, because you know it's fascinating. As you said initially, we will be attracted to someone who is opposite of us. When that doesn't work, then we get attracted to someone who's similar to us. But I think the whole key is how do we help people to understand Number one, what do they do before they ever get into that committed relationship to make sure that whatever it happens to be, they're able then to start doing that right from the get go. So for instance, understanding that you know that you are free going and you love to talk and so forth, and you know, here I am, and it's like, all right, I'm I've got a sock, I'm ready to put it in your mouth, the type of things, because that's my personality.

21:54 So so the question I have is, you know, I always believe in prevent versus you know, trying to do it later on. So what would you recommend to people at whatever age that are starting to get into a relationship. What would you suggest be some of the key elements that they consider and that they actually do to make sure that whatever that happens to be, Because they can be wonderful either way as long as you're figuring it out, What would you suggest people start with? How do they start to. Do this in a way that once they get into that committed relationship, they have a higher confidence of it working.

22:41 Well, you know, read my book. That's the simple answer. But I know that's not the answer you really want. But let me give you a little example. Okay, going back to my little chart here. Okay, So the relationships that work the most easily, and I have a whole chapter on this in the book, are those that have one where in common. Now, this doesn't guarantee success, but what I mean by that is, I'm I mentioned I'm these two. If I'm married to someone who is this, which I'm not. But if I'm married to someone who's this, we have the go go square in common. We both have the part of our personality that wants to go and do and accomplish and kick things off the list, that goal orientation. If someone has this combination, and this combination one spouse is the popular sanguine perfect I'm peaceful, ptleigmatic.

23:33 The other is the popular sanguine powerful color. They have the fun loving side in common. Does that make sense to you? It does? Yeah. Hey. The hardest combination make work is what my husband now and I have, which is when one person is the top two and the other is the bottom two. Because I'm like tightly wound, I'm turbo charged, because both parts of me are the extrovert, both parts of me are the hot personality. So while I say go, go, go, my husband, who's these two says no, no, no. Just a week or so ago, he said to me, do we have to do something every night? And honestly, we had nothing going on for four nights, but in his mind.

24:21 Wants to stay home, low key introverted. He felt that we were doing things too many nights and so and that's okay. We've been married eleven and a half years. We're going to make it to the end. I'm pretty sure. But by understanding those differences, by for me understanding that he doesn't want to go. And the night that I'm met referencing, I was telling him that I was going to something and he was not going. He was not expected to go. But before I even. Told him that, he said, do we have to have something every night? But I said, no, we don't. I'm not expecting you go. But because I understand he doesn't.

25:02 Like to go this stuff because he's this, then but I want to go, So I book things with my friends now if it's important, He goes with me. He knows that upfront. I let him know I would really like you to go this. I was in charge of a big event last week and was expected to go with me to that big event that I was in charge of. But I don't make him go to everything I go to. So what I'm saying is when you understand that at the beginning of a relationship, to identify that person's personality, and then you adjust your expectations based on their strengths and weaknesses. Like I understand my husband needs time in the recliner when he gets home. I mean, just Sunday at church, I wore an outfit to church that I probably haven't worn.

25:48 I don't know. I bought it probably thirteen years ago, and I told him this whole story about my outfit at church, or on the way to church, I told him, and he kind of looked at me, like. Why do I need to know this? Well, I'm just feeling the dead air. But I thought it was interesting, and so I'll just give me examples of kind of that different viewpoint, how we see things differently. But if we understand that, he and I were able to laugh. About that because I'm like, well, I know, I know you don't really care, but you know. And I said, I've got a picture of me that I sent you wearing this outfit when. We were dating. I could show it to you when we get home. And he said, he's so funny. It was real droll. He said, I don't need to see the picture. I'm looking at you now in that outfit. So, you know, we just we just see things differently. But when you understand that in a relationship, you can laugh about it rather than being hurt about it.

26:41 Does that make sense? Well? It does. And so when we're talking about, you know, being able to start a relationship at a much higher level, it sounds to me like number one, you need. To be able to praise a much higher level. Yeah, you need to identify who the other person is, what their personality time is, and you know, there are a bunch of other things that you need to identify, but definitely the personality type, what are their expectations or needs type of thing, and then be able to communicate. And I think that's where we get into a real challenge because obviously your husband is open enough to understand what you're talking about here.

27:25 Yeah, he is married to me. Yeah, but how many times do you find someone in a relationship where one is really open to wanting to be able to discuss this and understand the personality types and the differences and the different needs and so forth, their expectations, and the other person just like you know. That's so, that's just a bunch of goal. Well, it definitely does happen. But you know what, First off, if you're only dating, quit dating right now. But okay, if. You're you know, really committed to that relationship where you're already have fallen in loved this person and you're really committed to making this work, I can assure you that even if only one person applies this information, applies these concepts, and the other person is at least a decent human being.

28:14 And there is that because there are people with psychotic disorders and so forth. And we're not talking about them. We're talking about a normal, decent human being, and hopefully you wouldn't be dating them if they weren't that. But if you start meeting their needs, you start giving them what they need, even if they don't understand what you're doing, they will respond positively to that. But let me back up, if I ken Doug because I like to talk about I don't think we talked about this last time on our last episode. The visual clues. And this is important for dating because if you're dating someone in the very beginning, especially, it may be difficult to go up to them and say, excuse me, would you take this personality profile so I can figure you out?

29:00 That might be off putting early in a relationship. I mean, it kind of depends on the person. Some people are into this stuff, but some people are not. And but if you know what to watch for, and I mean body language, clothing, personal space, their car, and so forth, you can almost more accurately identify someone's personality than if you have them take a profile. Because for a lot of people, they have a lot of baggage tied up in who they think they are. There's what their parents wanted them to do, what their teachers wanted them to do, what their spouses want them to be, what their bosses want them to be. And by the time you get someone who's in their forties or fifties, they're often they don't really have a real clue who they are. But if you watch them day in and day out, and you see them at their best and you see them at their worst. You often can identify someone's personality type without having them have to take a persononality profile.

30:01 And then once you understand. That, then you begin to look at the strengths and the weaknesses of each personality type and the. Side can I live with? This? Is this something that I can live with? And you know, love overshadows all of that, and then we make that effort to meet the emotional needs as we talked about earlier. Well, and I think you made an interesting point, and this is something that has been a continuous element as I have interviewed a number of different people, particularly those that are marriage counselors. Or who are working with couples. And one of the interesting things that has come out more often than not is something that you made reference to, and that is that if there's one person that is willing to understand that and has the mindset and the ability to be patient enough to you know, start to understand the other personality even though you haven't done you know, the assessment or whatever, and start to respond to that in a positive way and communicate that in a positive way.

31:06 What what I have observed from everyone I've talked to is that more often than not, not always, but more often than not, the other person starts to come around. Yes, and all of. A sudden, you have a much better relationship. And I think that as that continues, usually I would think that that other person with the communication starts to understand. It a little bit more and appreciate it. It's just like, yeah, it's just like what your husband said. You know, you're the first person that understands me, you know. And I'm sure I don't know that that communication ever went on ahead of time, but all of a sudden he's having the realization that, wow, she understands me. So but here here's the element I want to talk about a little bit, because we have a whole other element that is that affects that, and that's the emotional intelligence level of the individual. And you know, there's a number of different models out there as far as emotional intelligence, level of emotions and so forth.

32:10 But have you found that? And I don't know if you've really looked into that at all, So let me start with that question. If not my expertise, I am fully aware of it, but it definitely is not my expertise. But I think I can answer your question. Anyway, So do you find that because the other thing that I find, which I find is fascinating, is that when you talk about these different personalities, when everything's going well, there's definitely you know how they act, how they behave, and so on and so forth. But when they're under stress, all of a sudden, you see an entirely different behavior very often. And so I guess the question I have is how do you deal with someone? For instance, I just wrote an article in Substack talking about, you know, our wonderful service people who have been truly have been to war, and the challenges is they come back with living life because here they've been dealing with an entirely different type of situation that they had to be.

33:20 In order to survive. Now they come back home that doesn't exist anymore, but in their mind it's still there. How do you help someone to understand that when someone gets under stress, they're going to behave a little bit differently, or maybe a lot differently, And how do you deal with that as the individual that's been receiving that different response. Well, as I said, you know emotional intelligence. I don't know that this really falls into emotional intelligence, but it's not my expertise. But remember I said a a few moments ago, when you're dealing with someone who's a good, decent, moral person, that they will usually respond positively.

34:05 When someone's dealing with PSD, for example, I'm not saying that they're not a good moral person. I'm just saying they're not functioning in a normal way what we would think of as normal, because of the stress that they have been through. So but what I want to address is not that level of stress. No, No, And I don't want to address that level either, because what I'm what I'm talking about is there are those that, depending on where they work or you know, their profession, or their childhood experiences or whatever that happens to be, or even the people that they tend to be around, or even social media, and the effect that that's having on them, all of a sudden, you see an entirely different level of emotion that is not necessarily equated to that personality type.

34:55 Well, let me let me explain it this way and see if if we're on the same page, and I think we probably will be. But as I've talked about repeatedly that I believe that this whole concept is a tool for growth, and that we use it, as we've been talking about, to reach out to those who are important to us. We use it to adjust our expectations of others and so forth. But to do that takes a level of emotional strength for me to step outside of who I am and give you what you need? Does that make sense so far? Absolutely so? But what if I'm under a lot of stress, I don't have the emotional energy.

35:39 To step outside of who I am and give you what you need. I'm going to revert back to who I am naturally and sadly under a lot of stress. Most of us function in our weaknesses, not in our strengths. And I've got here in this personality profile, this whole list of the strengths and the weakness of each personality type. So the goal of this whole concept is to use it as a tool for growth, and by that I mean to work to eliminate our weaknesses and function in our strengths. And not just function in our strengths, but to consciously work to acquire strengths.

36:19 That are not natural to us. And I probably mentioned this to you before, but you know I had to show up here. I had to be here with you. I had to have equipment, I had to get organized to do that that's not natural to me. And occasionally I do forget. It does happen, but very seldom because I really worked to gain strengths that are not natural to me. But again, I've had to work at that. It takes emotional energy to do that. And if I'm highly stressed, I don't have the energy to be nice to you, for example, I don't have energy to do those things that are not natural to me. And I think the key, there's two keys that I come from, get from what you just said. Number One, if we don't have that emotional strength at that point in time, if we're under stress, and so we're moving into that different personality type of situation. I think first of all, we need to be able to have the type of communication that we can say, Hey, I am under stress. You're seeing this behavior. Just understand has nothing to it has nothing to do with you, It has everything to.

37:26 Do with me. Just give me some time here. And I think that that becomes so important to be able to communicate that. The other thing that you mentioned is because yes, we are depending on our personality types and combinations thereof we will behave we have those weaknesses. I always say that, you know, if we go beyond the strength, all of a sudden, it becomes a weakness if we push so hard, and to understand that as we observe in our spouse or our partner or our dear friend, all of a sudden, we're seeing those weaknesses come out. We consciously can be aware that, hey, they're under stress, so that a sign of yeah, something's going something's going on there, and they may or may not, depending on their.

38:14 Personality, they want to talk about it. But we can certainly be there for them emotionally, and I think that becomes so key. So I agree. You know, this has been a great second communication. I love it because I think we've gotten into some other things that we missed the first time. So as we close, what would be that message to day that you'd like to share with the audience. Well, based on what we've talked about today, is that comes down to that level of caring about that relationship with the other person. I have found that virtually every relationship can work. Now again we're talking about normal you know, human beings here, but virtually every relationship can work.

38:59 But every relationship takes work. If you just expect it to cruise along on its own, it's going to fall apart. It takes work to keep a relationship together, but virtually every relationship can work if. You're wonderful and so real quickly, how do people find your website and your book? My website is the personality dot com and that's the word the TCH and the word personalities plural dot com. And podcasts like this that I do. I put them in the resources section, so there's a link to a lot of extra information. I've got recordings free recordings. Of speeches that I've given also the Personality profile. Is there an electronic version? And Amazon has my book. You can buy it on my website too, but honestly, I prefer you buy it on Amazon, as strange as that sounds.

39:51 They'll get it to you quicker and cheaper than I will. And if you are a Kindle Unlimited member, my book is read for you. Uh. That's wonderful, Murda, thank you so much again. Been a delight to be with you again. Thank you. I really appreciate it. And folks, I hope you, I hope you're. Getting some key elements out of this something that's going to make a difference for you. Appreciate your listening, look forward to having to join us again soon. This is doctor Doug saying now mistay With you.