July 22, 2024

Truth And Transcendence

Truth And Transcendence

Welcome Catherine Liewellyn to the show.
Consciousness is often considered a one level experience. But the reality is that the state of consciousness has different levels within us. When we can achieve higher levels of state of consciousness we are...

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Welcome Catherine Liewellyn to the show.
Consciousness is often considered a one level experience. But the reality is that the state of consciousness has different levels within us. When we can achieve higher levels of state of consciousness we are able to recognize those imprints in our lives for what they are, and understand that they are not us.
Catherine explains how we can achieve those higher states of consciousness in rather uniques ways.
https://beingspace.world

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This program is designed to provide general information with regards

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to the subject matters covered. This information is given with

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the understanding that neither the hosts, guests, sponsors, or station

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are engaged in rendering any specific and personal medical, financial,

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legal counseling, professional service, or any advice. You should seek

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the services of competent professionals before applying or trying any

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suggested ideas.

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At the end of the day, it's not about what

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you have or even what you've accomplished. It's about what

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you've done with those accomplishments. It's about who you've lifted up,

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who you've made better. It's about what you've given back.

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Thanzel Washington, Welcome to Inspire Vision. Our sole purpose is

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to elevate the lives of others and to inspire you

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to do the same.

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Catherine, welcome to the show.

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Thank you, Doug very much.

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Indeed, Oh, I'm pleased to have you on the show

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as I've read some more about what you're doing, and

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obviously you have an incredible podcast yourself. I find it

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fascinating and I think this is going to be an

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interesting discussion. What I'd love for you to do is

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to share with the audience who you are and maybe

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the story behind how you got to this point.

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Okay, Well, I was born to a very interesting alternative couple.

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My father's name was Douglas. Actually, that's the name that's

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been very present for me all my life. And they

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were kind of unusual in the sense that they were

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kind of anti establishment, freethinking, alternative, Bohemian, natural health, you know,

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all that kind of thing, which meant right from the

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very beginning, I was encouraged to question things, and I

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was encouraged to try to take responsibility for myself, which

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to me was always good news at the age of six,

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and also to see the possibility of celebration in life.

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There was a My parents were Scotts as well as

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being very alternative, and the Scots, I don't know if

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we know them very well, are probably partly to do

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with living in a very hostile environment with all the

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mountains and the rain, but they've got this extraordinary sense

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of humor of we're going to have fun no matter what,

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no matter how bad it gets, We're going to say,

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every crisis can be turned into a game, you know.

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And so that was my roots really and I think

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from there on I kind of ricocheted back and forth

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between following that particular lead and going deeper and deeper

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into all of the wonderful unfoldings that can occur from

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that and the other side of the extreme, all the

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usual problems and issues of I'm a child. Does nobody

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like me at school?

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You know?

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Is someone bullying me? Am I being bossy? Or am

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I just being assertive?

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You know?

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All of the start adolescent, all this stuff in adolescents,

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all of the stuff everybody has. So I had having

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that kind of interesting background didn't save me from all

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of the developmental experiences that we're all exposed to.

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The care.

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I did, actually, at one point in kind of entertain

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the illusion that it's possible to get rid of all

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the baggage, you know, that it's possible to rise above

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all of these human concerns and ego issues, et cetera.

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And for several years I tried to just get rid

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of them all until I realized that this was a

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really stupid endeavor, utterly impossible, and besides, why bother, it's

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not really you know, So I went through all of

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that as well. So I've now landed at a place

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where I'm working with people quite a lot, doing quite

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a lot of group work. I think a lot of

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people at the moment are looking for connection, community group

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sort of group exploration, particularly after the last few years

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that were very isolating for a lot of people, and

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people are kind of trying to soak up some love,

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you know, in whatever context that might be, and also

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doing one to one transformative coaching work. And I'm kind

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of integrating a number of different threads that have run

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through that I've become interested in and immersed in in

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my life, and one of those is the humanistic psychology

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thread of you know, we all have the possibility at

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least of choosing what we want to do with our

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lives and choosing our own growth, and that we do

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naturally want to grow and that we will naturally heal

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unless you know, that whole kind of thrust. And then

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another whole thrust, which is around conscious movement, living, inhabiting

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the body, allowing the body to move, breathe process, express

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that whole kind of free spirit physical embodiment aspect of

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being alive. And the third one being about energy and spirituality,

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you know, consciousness. I've done a lot of work with

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energy healing modalities and I'm still working with one of

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those now. So I'm working with a number of things

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with clients, one to one, with people in groups, and

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I'm running my podcast Truth and Transcendence, which you kindly

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said kind words of that. So that's a bit about

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the beginning and where I am now and just the

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bits in between.

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Okay, well that's great, And you know, you mentioned something

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that I find fascinating and I think there can be

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a really strong debate about this because you talked about

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you know, and obviously as we think about our lives,

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and I think most of us that have really studied this,

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investigated and research that know that our lives, our experience

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in lives, you're so controlled by those subconscious belief systems,

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imprints all of those types of things, or at least

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they can be controlling. And there's a lot of people

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that say we need to get rid of those, and

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that's what you brought up. You know, I need to

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get rid of those, and yet the reality is you're saying, no,

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I don't. And so I think for a lot of

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people that I've talked to, the concept then becomes recognize

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that it's there, and I think this is where consciousness

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comes in. So we can talk about that but recognize

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that it's there. But once you recognize it and accept it,

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it just kind of goes away and it no longer

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becomes the effect of what's going on. What are your

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thoughts on that and what's been your experience with that?

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Yeah, I would say that that dynamic is a very

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strong tendency, you know, the sense that when we become

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aware of something it then changes. The only thing about

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it is it doesn't necessarily change one hundred percent forever,

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so we still go in and out. So you know,

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I've done a lot of work around what you're talking

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about there of recognizing the conditioning and the limiting beliefs.

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I'm acutely aware that those are not who I am,

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they are not the heart of me. They are programming.

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And because I'm aware of that is, of course I

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feel much more free to actually live in the present

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and make my own choices. And yet there are still

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situations that can throw me right back into that. And

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that's when it gets really tricky. When we think we've

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got it, when we think we're enlightened, when we think

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we've transcended it all, and then something happens and we're

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reminded with a crash that we're still human.

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And how does consciousness fit into that? Your definition of consciousness,

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I'd love to know what that is and how does

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that fit into exactly what you're talking about.

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Well, first off, I don't think it's possible to define

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consciousness because it's infinite and it's everywhere you know, it's

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in everybody, it's in everything. So people do ask me

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to define consciousness and either I can't do that when

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I can say that my experience is that my state

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of consciousness, anyone's state of consciousness does pretty much dictate

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our perception of everything. So if the state of consciousness

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is a state of equanimity, a state of acceptance, a

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state of love, a state of devotion to the divine,

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when we're in that state of consciousness, everything that happens

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to us feels and is experienced completely differently from when

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we are in a completely different state of consciousness. And equally,

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our state of consciousness actually dictates how the body functions.

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You know, there are some people who have this kind

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of wonderful glow about them who never seem to get sick,

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and it's something to do with the fact that that

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state of consciousness actually supports the body functioning as it's

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supposed to rather than interfering, because when we get well

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tangled up in the self limiting beliefs, we can literally

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cause tensions and blockages within the body which can actually

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make us sick and eventually kill us, you know. And

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that's a very extreme way of describing it.

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Well, yeah, And as you talk about from what I'm hearing,

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as you're talking about state quote state of consciousness, what

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I'm really hearing you say is that consciousness are We're

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not going to define that. We could talk about awareness

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and all of that, but the reality is that there

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are different levels of the state of consciousness. Is what

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if I'm hearing what you're saying right is kind of

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like a ladder. Are we on the first step right

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at the bottom or are we much higher? And is

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that kind of what you're trying to talk about? That

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we all have a certain state of consciousness and depending

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on the level of that state of consciousness determines to

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some degree our experience in life.

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Absolutely, and we move between different states of consciousness much

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more easily than we think. Our state of consciousness can

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just shift just like that. But the thing about it

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is when we're really conscious and aware in the present,

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we recognize that experience and it's absolutely wonderful. We know

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we're there, we're not there. We don't realize we're not there.

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Because we're not there. Because we're not there.

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It's also the weird mystery thing that goes off.

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So if if we're not at that higher level, we

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don't even know that we're not at that higher level,

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that type of thing.

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In order to know, we would have to be at

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the higher level in order to be able to be

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aware at which level we were at. You know, So

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I think the best I think the best thing we

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can do is to sort of practice paying attention. Practice. Well,

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there's all sorts of practices that kind of drop into

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our experience, drop into being present. I went to yoga

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this morning, and this particular lady who I've only just

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started going to is very good at having us do

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really really simple physical movements that actually help us to

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come into a different state of awareness. And she says

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at the beginning, you know, you can't practice the state

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of awareness, according to her theory, but you can practice

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the physical movement and that will shift your awareness. Do

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we understand how that happens. No, does it matter. No,

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What matters is you're kind of openheartedly we're opening ourselves

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to the possibility of shifting the consciousness.

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Okay, So for those of us that are at that

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lower revel level of consciousness, and we don't even know

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where at the lower level, how do you help us

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to be able to move up to that higher level

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to where we actually are conscious enough to know that

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we're conscious?

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Well, do you know what? I think that awful lot

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of people are actually on that path now, and probably

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most of the people listening to this podcast are actually

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on that path in the sense of, you know, a

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lot of people have been to retreats, They've been been

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to yoga for example, They've meditated, they've done conscious dance,

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they've done weird sort of water treatments, you know, all

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sorts of things that we've done. And I think for

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each of us, there are things that kind of really resonate.

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And I would always recommend to people look out up

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for the things that really resonate. You know, if you

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try something and it really resonates, weave it into your life,

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you know, integrate it into your life so it becomes

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part of your lifestyle. You know, don't say, God, that

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really blew my mind. Right, Let's just go back to

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my life and ignore I ever did it, which is

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sadly what many of us have done in the past.

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And if you try something and it doesn't really resonate,

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leave it.

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Well, and you talk about different things. One of the

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things you really hit on is meditation. And you know,

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even yoga is a part of meditation. But you know,

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I happen to meditate. I try to meditate every day.

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Sometimes I don't get a chance to do then. But

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how much does meditation, for instance, Let's talk about the

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different areas you said that people could find that resonate

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with them. Let's talk about a few of those that

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you have understood to be helpful to people.

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I'm working at the moment with an energy modality called Pellowa.

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I don't know that's it.

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No, I've not heard of it.

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It's quite new over here. It's out of Australia, channeled

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by the founder about twenty years ago, twenty one years now,

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and just came to the UK six years ago. And

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there's about three or four practitioners in the US, right,

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so it's really really really early. It's an energy technique

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and it's a consciousness modality. So in order to practice that,

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you find a practitioner and you have a treatment. It's

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like a sixty minute treatment. It's hands off, distant or

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in person. Now, how that works is that the the

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Pellower energy, and I'm going to use terms which might

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sound a bit new ag okay, but the Pellow energy

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comes directly from sources. It's like a very fine, very

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powerful energy. And in this particular practice, the practitioner doesn't

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direct the energy at all. The energy doesn't come through

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the practitioner. They don't channel it. They just literally they

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are like a kind of introductory agent. They just go

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Pellower Doug. Let's say you have a treatment, Pellower Doug,

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Doug Pellower over to you, right, and then the Pellow

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client contract together as to what that client's consciousness requires

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for to make a shift for their highs potential, and

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the Pellower delivers that whatever it is.

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Okay, but obviously obviously is my guide. You are pain

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some things to help me to learn to integrate with that.

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PLO right, absolutely not know. The whole principle is that

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your consciousness knows everything it needs to know in terms

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of what you actually need. So at each point in

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our lives. The shift we need next could is unique

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to us in any given moment, and it's different every

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day and different at different points in the same day. So,

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for example, if I think about shifts that I've experienced

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using this particular modality, one shift might have been the

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shift of letting go of striving as an example. Now

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that's that's an example which lots of people talk about,

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lots of people read books about they practice ways to

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try and let go of striving, et cetera, et cetera,

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et cetera. If somebody, if that's what somebody needs, then

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what Pelowa does It comes in and helps activate that

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person's consciousness for that shit take place within that sixty

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minute period without the client necessarily even understanding how that happened.

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But when they come out of it, it has happened.

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But before they go in, they might not know that's

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the shift that they needed. So I've had many of

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these treatments. I'm now a teacher as well. I've never

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known when I go into one of these treatments, I

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never know what I'm going to get from it, because,

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as you say, we've got so many layers of consciousness,

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many of them are on they are below the conscious level.

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So I'm not one hundred percent informed about what shift

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it is that I most need next. But if I'm

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prepared to trust and go, okay, I'm just going to

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subject myself to this and just receive and just allow

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this energy to come in interact with my consciousness, activate

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the shift and see what happens, then you see what happens.

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So it's this is for people who are willing and

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have the capacity to kind of be that receptive, you know,

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to just let it. It's not for everybody. I mean,

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I'm saying for some people. They would hear me saying that,

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they go no, no, no. People that other people listen

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to that, think what you mean all I have to

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do is lie there and just be recepted for an

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hour and then just receive the gift I'm given through

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the experience. Other people are going to go, yeah, yes, please.

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So do you remember yourself? I'm private inn between one

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of those because if you say all right, receive pollowa

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and I'm sitting here, yeah.

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So you know the reality is that do you do

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you just say a few.

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Words and then you're quiet for the hour, or is

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there some things that you say during the course.

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Of it, or how does it have no speaking.

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And how do you get them to the point that

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they are receptive and they can start to sense it.

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The the the gauge of the of the readiness is

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that the person has told me they want the treatment

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and they've paid for it, okay, because because the idea

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is that each percharge of themselves. So if they decide

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they want to do it, that's the that's consent. And

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if they're paid for it, or they greed pay for

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it at the end of the session, whatever, that's them

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placing the value on it and a value on themselves

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in that regard.

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All right, So if someone says, as you said, there's

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some that say no, I don't want anything to do

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with it, what's my next choice? Well, what are some

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of the other choices I have to be able to

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develop that elevated level of consciousness.

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So another example is conscious dance. So in conscious dance,

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what are you familiar with conscious dance? Perhaps so you

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will be in a minute.

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Okay.

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For most of our lives, we're either just not aware

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what we're doing with our bodies at all, or we're

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using our body in repetitive the same way like you're

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looking at a screen, you're sitting on a chair, You're

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using your body to walk to the bathroom and back,

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walk to the kitchen, walk to the car, drive in

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the car. And what happens with that particular dynamic is

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we lose touch with the experience of the body. We

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lose touch of that whole raft of layers of consciousness

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that are actually living in the physical body. If you

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go to a conscious dance session, usually there's some music playing.

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Usually the facilitator will say some things actually at the

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beginning and during and what you're encouraged to do is

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let go into movement and just simply allow the body

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to move exactly as it wishes to, without planning it,

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without trying to follow any steps, just just completely just

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following and seeing what happens. Again, it's quite receptive. But

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some people this is more acceptable, you know, accessible, than

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something like pillower because I'm in a room, I've got

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my eyes open, I'm moving my body. Right, what's the

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worst that could happen? You know, this is not mystical, right,

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they say to themselves, Well, I say, everything's mistical. But anyway,

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so by allowing the body to simply move. What happens

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is that a lot of the experiences and thought forms

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and emotions and so forth that are held inside the body,

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which can be accessed through meditation, can be accessed working

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with Pella, but can be accessed through movement as you

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move the body, as the energy moves around the body.

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Because it's not a planned, choreographed movement, it's organic. What

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tends to happen is that the things that need to

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be released get released, and the things that want to

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sort of come out as an expression, let's say, an

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expression of joy or creativity or color or vibrancy that

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is then permitted to come out because there's no restriction

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on the movement. Now, I've known people who've used just

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that modality and that alone for decades to achieve extraordinary

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shifts in consciousness.

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Okay, then that sounds interesting. And then you again, you

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mentioned meditation. How do people? How do people? Because I thought,

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I think a lot of people that are listening to

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this would probably lean more towards meditation if they really

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knew how to do it and how that can work.

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Can you share a little bit about your experience with

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meditation and how that can help people.

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Yes, I am. I really like the expression meditative states

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to doing meditation. I think you mentioned earlier a distinction.

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Do being and doing Yes, absolutely, and.

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That whole the minute we try to sort of do

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meditation were then I heard someone saying, once you know,

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it's not a competitive sport, you know, it's a being

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this that we're seeking to do. So I think that's

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the first thing in the mind to think, can I

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drop into a meditative state? Can I release myself into that?

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And then just simply to even simply sitting there and

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just letting go of trying to do anything at all

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in the mind, not trying to do anything at all

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with the emotions, just simply observing. To me, that's level

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one of meditation. To me, that's the first piece in

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terms of meditation, and for many people that on its

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own is quite an accomplishment, yes, you know. And then

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there are various other layers, like another one being the

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one with a focus, where you choose a focus, whether

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it's a candle flame, whether it's a particular idea, whether

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it's a particular quality, whatever it might be, that focus

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and coming back to focus, coming back to focus, coming

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back to focus, coming back to focus is a powerful

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training for the mind and for the being, and so

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that's very different from just dropping in and just.

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You know.

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And then another one that is very powerful is journaling,

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which is a form of meditation, you know, and in

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journaling it's it's we are just it's a discipline of

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putting into words on paper or scribbles or doodles or images,

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doesn't matter, whatever's going through the mind, and just not

399
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censoring it, not trying to control it, not trying to

400
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package it, just literally flooding it all out onto the paper.

401
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That's a wonderful practice because again that's another way of

402
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letting go of the ego control, letting go of trying

403
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to package ourselves into this sort of I'm going to

404
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say male principle, but I'm talking about the structure principle,

405
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the intentional principle, the doing principle, you know, letting go

406
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of that which which often when people men say that's

407
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what they're trying to do, not they do the more

408
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flowing side of themselves.

409
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So the examples, Yeah, and you keep mentioning an ego,

410
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and I find that a fascinating, fascinating concept. You know,

411
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we talk about ego and you talk about you know,

412
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trying to eliminate that desiring and so forth. But really,

413
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the ego is the thing that really is causing so

414
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much trouble in our life because we're desiring this, We're

415
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wishing we had this, we're wish we could be this,

416
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all of those types of things. And yet if we're

417
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able to control that ego to the point where it

418
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no longer fits into that realm, but rather it's just

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there to truly help us to live the type of

420
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life that we want to live, it makes a difference.

421
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What are your thoughts about the ego? I know that.

422
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Ekar totally talks about that a lot in his books.

423
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I know if you've read those, But any thoughts on

424
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you keep bringing up ego, So talk a little bit

425
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about ego.

426
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Yes, so, well, ego is there for a very good reason.

427
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We need it. You know, we need to have an

428
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identityere we are. We are incarnate in a physical body

429
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right now, and so you know, in order to manage

430
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that and manage life, we do need ego. And I

431
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think what you're saying is that we don't want ego

432
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to take over. We don't want ego to run the life.

433
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We want it to be a facility that we have

434
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from yes. And one of the great ways to do that,

435
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I think, is to give it a project. Give it

436
00:27:39.000 --> 00:27:42.400
a project. Be happy, right, because it wants to be

437
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doing a project. You know, it's quite resourceful, the ego,

438
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it's quite clever. So just give it a project, you know.

439
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So the project could be I'm going to refurbish my house,

440
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or the project could be I'm going to launch a

441
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new workshop, or the project could be I'm going to

442
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practice eight different types of meditation by the month, So

443
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these could be You can use your ego to actually

444
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strengthen the choice that you want to make, where the

445
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choice is coming from spirital, from heart, not from ego.

446
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So it's almost like you trick the ego. You trick

447
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the ego into being the servant.

448
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Well, and a lot of it depends on the purpose

449
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behind that. So for instance, you say, you know, one

450
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thing would be you know, let's fix up the house. Well,

451
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if the ego is saying, let's fix up the house

452
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because it would be more comfortable for my children, for

453
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my family, we'll find greater peace here. That's the ego

454
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not really controlling you. If you say, oh, I want

455
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to fix up my house because I want people to

456
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see how cool my house is, and you know, really

457
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show them how cool I am and my family is.

458
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All of a sudden, the ego is entirely different, and

459
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so in my mind, really the purpose behind those activities

460
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really determine whether we're using the ego in a in

461
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a healthy way or whether we're using it in an

462
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unhealthy way.

463
00:29:04.160 --> 00:29:06.759
Yeah, well, or shall we say in service to our

464
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highest good?

465
00:29:07.839 --> 00:29:08.119
Really?

466
00:29:08.279 --> 00:29:10.960
Yes, because you can tell me that that example with

467
00:29:11.039 --> 00:29:13.359
a house, I think is a good one because I've

468
00:29:13.440 --> 00:29:17.559
I've I've refurbished houses myself, and I've done it for

469
00:29:17.720 --> 00:29:23.759
both those two different reasons on different occasions. Actually, it's like, hey,

470
00:29:23.759 --> 00:29:27.279
this is going to look really amazing and impressive, right,

471
00:29:27.599 --> 00:29:31.640
And it did to be fair, but it lacked heart,

472
00:29:32.799 --> 00:29:36.720
you know, and where I am now, part of you know,

473
00:29:36.759 --> 00:29:39.119
I want it to be welcoming to people. I wanted

474
00:29:39.160 --> 00:29:40.799
to you know, there's a whole number of things I

475
00:29:40.839 --> 00:29:43.319
wanted for it. I wanted to support me to do

476
00:29:43.359 --> 00:29:46.240
the work I want to do to help people, et cetera.

477
00:29:46.720 --> 00:29:49.119
So the feeling in this property I'm in now is

478
00:29:49.160 --> 00:29:53.319
completely different. And I've been to other people's properties, you know,

479
00:29:53.359 --> 00:29:56.039
where Let's say someone spent to fortune and you walk in.

480
00:29:56.119 --> 00:30:01.039
You can't get comfortable in here. I can't get comfortable.

481
00:30:01.720 --> 00:30:05.119
You know, It's okay, nothing wrong with the cushions, right,

482
00:30:05.640 --> 00:30:08.359
I just don't feel at another place, which might be

483
00:30:08.400 --> 00:30:13.200
a lot less impressive, but which is full of heart.

484
00:30:15.319 --> 00:30:18.160
It's interesting how we feel that energy, isn't it. I

485
00:30:18.200 --> 00:30:22.039
mean from someone else. You actually feel the energy of

486
00:30:22.160 --> 00:30:26.319
that quote ego, whether it's one of empowerment and kindness

487
00:30:26.359 --> 00:30:29.359
and love, or whether it's one of you know that

488
00:30:29.680 --> 00:30:33.000
I'm important, I'm good, I'm better that type of thing.

489
00:30:33.559 --> 00:30:36.759
So the energy is fascinating. So here's a question that

490
00:30:36.799 --> 00:30:39.279
does come to my mind, is we think about consciousness,

491
00:30:39.960 --> 00:30:45.119
how does curiosity and inquiry come into that? And do

492
00:30:45.200 --> 00:30:48.240
you have to reach a certain level of consciousness, healthy

493
00:30:48.279 --> 00:30:52.920
consciousness in order to be able to start really getting curious,

494
00:30:53.119 --> 00:30:56.960
getting you know, inquiring what's going on, inquiring what's going on?

495
00:30:57.240 --> 00:30:59.880
And how does that make a difference in our lives.

496
00:31:00.920 --> 00:31:04.720
I would say that curiosity and inquiry are our birthright.

497
00:31:04.759 --> 00:31:08.799
We're born with those. They are completely inherent to us.

498
00:31:08.839 --> 00:31:12.960
And I would say that curiosity and inquiry are two

499
00:31:12.960 --> 00:31:15.400
of the things in the human race that have allowed

500
00:31:15.480 --> 00:31:20.759
us to survive at all with our ridiculously pathetic bodies. Honestly,

501
00:31:20.880 --> 00:31:22.960
I mean, if you look at us compared to other creatures,

502
00:31:23.440 --> 00:31:26.359
the fact we've survived is phenomenal. And I think curiosity

503
00:31:26.400 --> 00:31:30.079
and inquiry has saved us. Unfortunately, I think as we

504
00:31:30.119 --> 00:31:34.839
go through life and we take on conditioning and self

505
00:31:34.880 --> 00:31:38.160
limiting beliefs and so forth, those two things can get

506
00:31:38.200 --> 00:31:40.759
masked and can and can kind of get we can

507
00:31:40.799 --> 00:31:45.759
get a bit sort of disconnected from that side of

508
00:31:46.799 --> 00:31:49.200
you asked any And I think when we kind of

509
00:31:49.319 --> 00:31:53.079
clear away the dross you know in our lives of

510
00:31:53.960 --> 00:31:57.039
I don't know, situations that aren't very authentic, or situations

511
00:31:57.039 --> 00:31:59.680
that don't serve us, or where we are not serving

512
00:31:59.720 --> 00:32:01.440
others or you know, when we kind of clear that

513
00:32:01.480 --> 00:32:05.119
stuff away and we invest in our consciousness and our

514
00:32:05.160 --> 00:32:09.039
awareness and so forth, I think curiosity and inquiry tend

515
00:32:09.160 --> 00:32:12.240
to become much more vivid. Again. I mean, I've seen

516
00:32:12.240 --> 00:32:14.680
this over and over where someone's come to work with

517
00:32:14.680 --> 00:32:17.160
me and they've said one of the things they've said is, oh, no,

518
00:32:17.240 --> 00:32:20.880
I'm not a creative person. No, no, curiosity not really, no,

519
00:32:20.880 --> 00:32:24.960
no no, And they start working and they start clearing

520
00:32:25.000 --> 00:32:28.640
stuff out that he's clearing out, and they start recognizing

521
00:32:28.680 --> 00:32:32.599
their strengths and celebrating those more, taking pleasure in those,

522
00:32:32.799 --> 00:32:36.240
using them more fully. Before we know it, they become

523
00:32:36.279 --> 00:32:41.000
really inventive and curious and inquiring, and they say, what

524
00:32:41.039 --> 00:32:43.480
have you done to me? I'm just really curious all

525
00:32:43.519 --> 00:32:45.079
the time now, And I don't know it was in

526
00:32:45.119 --> 00:32:49.119
there before. I haven't done anything to you. I haven't

527
00:32:49.160 --> 00:32:52.880
kind of spiked your coffee. It was already in there.

528
00:32:53.400 --> 00:32:55.319
It's just it was covered up. Someone used to call

529
00:32:55.359 --> 00:32:59.279
it layers of peanut butter. Covered in layers of peanut butter.

530
00:32:59.359 --> 00:33:03.680
So you can't sort of find the sort of innocent, inquiring,

531
00:33:03.799 --> 00:33:08.319
creative spirit that's in there in all of us.

532
00:33:09.799 --> 00:33:13.759
So as you were working with people and you find that,

533
00:33:14.200 --> 00:33:16.839
and you use the word mystic, you know, little woo

534
00:33:16.839 --> 00:33:20.920
woo that type of thing. Have you found that as

535
00:33:20.920 --> 00:33:23.400
you get into that, does it help to talk a

536
00:33:23.400 --> 00:33:26.920
little bit about the quantum field and the science behind

537
00:33:26.960 --> 00:33:30.160
that and helping people to understand that. You know, within

538
00:33:30.200 --> 00:33:33.559
the last ten to twenty years, scientists have all of

539
00:33:33.599 --> 00:33:37.319
a sudden become so aware of all of this energy

540
00:33:37.359 --> 00:33:41.359
and frequency that's coming from not within, well, it is

541
00:33:41.400 --> 00:33:45.359
within also, but is from without also, And how what

542
00:33:45.559 --> 00:33:50.680
you're doing literally is taking advantage and tapping into that

543
00:33:50.880 --> 00:33:55.000
energy and that frequency that's literally in the quantum field.

544
00:33:55.000 --> 00:33:57.759
We could call it the universal field, the divine field,

545
00:33:57.880 --> 00:33:58.880
whatever you want to call it.

546
00:33:59.680 --> 00:34:05.880
Yes, I don't use that language very much myself, although

547
00:34:05.920 --> 00:34:08.079
I love it. You know, I think there are people

548
00:34:08.119 --> 00:34:12.480
much more well informed than I talking about that particular

549
00:34:13.639 --> 00:34:16.639
how can I put it way of describing it? I

550
00:34:16.679 --> 00:34:18.719
do talk about universe, and I do think it's very

551
00:34:18.800 --> 00:34:22.840
useful and very helpful, and particularly for some people, people

552
00:34:22.880 --> 00:34:25.599
who've got what you might call a technical mind. Yes,

553
00:34:26.360 --> 00:34:29.039
and I think it's very helpful for them to hang

554
00:34:29.079 --> 00:34:32.079
it on structures like that. And for that reason, I'm

555
00:34:32.079 --> 00:34:35.000
delighted there are so many wonderful people now doing this work.

556
00:34:35.559 --> 00:34:37.920
I've had people on my podcast who are very very

557
00:34:37.960 --> 00:34:42.679
good at talking about it in that particular way, usually

558
00:34:42.719 --> 00:34:48.360
men interestingly, and it's it's it's I think I celebrate.

559
00:34:48.400 --> 00:34:55.159
I think it's fantastic. I I tend to not talk

560
00:34:55.239 --> 00:34:59.519
so much about defining terms. I think something I do

561
00:34:59.559 --> 00:35:02.079
find though, and I'm working with people, is sometimes they

562
00:35:02.119 --> 00:35:04.840
come up with defining terms for what they're learning and

563
00:35:04.880 --> 00:35:08.880
what they're experiencing, and that then it's then they've got

564
00:35:08.880 --> 00:35:12.679
their own terms, which might be you know, quantum, et cetera,

565
00:35:13.039 --> 00:35:16.360
it might be a word that they've come up with. Right,

566
00:35:16.719 --> 00:35:20.320
So I tend to be more facilitated with people finding

567
00:35:21.039 --> 00:35:25.000
the words more than giving them the words.

568
00:35:25.000 --> 00:35:27.719
Well, yeah, and you know, you talk about men, and

569
00:35:27.760 --> 00:35:30.559
you're right, we're I think generally and not going to

570
00:35:30.559 --> 00:35:33.599
say specifically, but generally we tend to be a little

571
00:35:33.599 --> 00:35:38.440
bit more left brain analytic, and generally women tend to

572
00:35:38.480 --> 00:35:42.719
be a little bit more heartfelt and you know, think

573
00:35:42.719 --> 00:35:46.119
from their heart rather than you know that and and

574
00:35:46.159 --> 00:35:49.119
so I find that, yes, in my case, particularly since

575
00:35:49.159 --> 00:35:52.000
I come from a scientific background. For me, as I

576
00:35:52.079 --> 00:35:54.199
started to hear and learn about all of this stuff,

577
00:35:54.239 --> 00:35:58.039
I'm thinking, you know, this sounds really fascinating, but I

578
00:35:58.079 --> 00:36:02.679
want to know the science behind it. Yes, fantastic, you know,

579
00:36:02.760 --> 00:36:05.920
And as I've studied it, what has happened is it

580
00:36:06.039 --> 00:36:11.000
is for me, it has actually moved into a situation

581
00:36:11.440 --> 00:36:15.639
of the as you say, the divinity, the universal part

582
00:36:15.719 --> 00:36:17.840
of it, And all of a sudden we begin to

583
00:36:17.920 --> 00:36:21.519
really understand that what you're doing, what other people are doing,

584
00:36:21.519 --> 00:36:23.719
and when we're meditating, when we're doing all of those

585
00:36:23.760 --> 00:36:28.239
types of things, that we're really tapping into a power

586
00:36:28.320 --> 00:36:33.840
of frequency and energy that exists and it works. And

587
00:36:33.239 --> 00:36:36.280
I think for people to be able to move forward

588
00:36:36.760 --> 00:36:39.559
and go through whatever process you know, they seem to

589
00:36:39.599 --> 00:36:43.280
resonate with, there has to be that initial belief system

590
00:36:43.679 --> 00:36:44.960
that this is going to work for me.

591
00:36:47.880 --> 00:36:50.920
I would say, either a belief system this is going

592
00:36:50.920 --> 00:36:55.400
to work for me, or an intuition that it's worth trying.

593
00:36:56.039 --> 00:36:56.320
Yes.

594
00:36:57.519 --> 00:37:01.440
Either I've had people turn up on my Hello workshops

595
00:37:02.000 --> 00:37:06.920
walking never met them before. They've booked. I know they've booked.

596
00:37:06.920 --> 00:37:08.559
I've sent them in emails saying thank you for booking.

597
00:37:08.800 --> 00:37:12.559
They've walked in and they've said, I have no idea

598
00:37:12.559 --> 00:37:16.480
why I'm here. I have no idea why I booked this.

599
00:37:16.760 --> 00:37:19.400
I just saw it. I saw your thing on Facebook.

600
00:37:19.880 --> 00:37:23.559
I kept seeing it on Facebook, and then one day

601
00:37:23.559 --> 00:37:27.320
I just booked myself on I don't know why, right.

602
00:37:27.440 --> 00:37:31.000
And I always say to them, well, it's your higher

603
00:37:31.039 --> 00:37:33.679
self that's brought you here, and your higher self is

604
00:37:33.760 --> 00:37:39.239
very clever, so you're going to be fine.

605
00:37:39.360 --> 00:37:42.440
And I love that because you know, you talk about intuition.

606
00:37:42.760 --> 00:37:44.639
And you know, I was just I was just on

607
00:37:44.719 --> 00:37:48.199
the podcast the other day interviewing someone and they were

608
00:37:48.239 --> 00:37:54.360
talking very much about intuition, and I find that people

609
00:37:54.480 --> 00:37:59.360
sometimes don't recognize how important and how valuable intuition is.

610
00:37:59.679 --> 00:38:02.280
How do how do you help someone to.

611
00:38:02.239 --> 00:38:07.360
Be able to tap into that intuitive state that allows

612
00:38:07.440 --> 00:38:09.679
them to be able to move forward without having to

613
00:38:09.679 --> 00:38:11.440
always be this scientific mind.

614
00:38:12.880 --> 00:38:18.559
Well it's a journey, really, so sometimes it takes a

615
00:38:18.599 --> 00:38:21.480
while for someone to really really tap into that and

616
00:38:22.000 --> 00:38:26.239
really trust it. But if somebody wants like a shorthand

617
00:38:26.280 --> 00:38:29.800
way to begin that journey, the easiest way to do

618
00:38:29.840 --> 00:38:33.840
it is to look back over your life and ask yourself,

619
00:38:35.599 --> 00:38:37.599
what are the moments in my life where I made

620
00:38:37.599 --> 00:38:41.559
a decision or something shifted in my life and it

621
00:38:41.639 --> 00:38:44.800
turned out well, and I don't really understand how that happened.

622
00:38:47.280 --> 00:38:52.079
We've all got them. Yes, those moments are usually moments

623
00:38:52.119 --> 00:38:58.400
where we followed our intuition without necessarily waiting for a

624
00:38:58.440 --> 00:39:00.880
scientific explanation for the sison you were making?

625
00:39:02.079 --> 00:39:05.480
Did that well as we look as as we look

626
00:39:05.519 --> 00:39:07.440
at that though, and see that there are times where

627
00:39:07.559 --> 00:39:10.480
quote we had intuition and we made a mistake. How

628
00:39:10.840 --> 00:39:12.599
do you get to the point where you're able to

629
00:39:12.719 --> 00:39:16.480
learn which is a valid, healthy intuition and which one

630
00:39:16.559 --> 00:39:18.920
may be just based on some emotions.

631
00:39:20.920 --> 00:39:24.559
That takes practice. Basically, I'm saying that there's no other way.

632
00:39:24.679 --> 00:39:29.639
That takes practice over off years. That's years and years

633
00:39:29.639 --> 00:39:34.159
of practice. I've been practicing for years and it's still

634
00:39:34.199 --> 00:39:38.360
not perfect. It really is something you just you have

635
00:39:38.400 --> 00:39:40.719
to decide to practice it. That's the thing. I mean,

636
00:39:40.800 --> 00:39:42.519
some people, a lot of us go through life and

637
00:39:42.559 --> 00:39:47.920
never decide to practice that, never decide to practice understanding

638
00:39:47.920 --> 00:39:52.599
our intuitive faculties. You can do that on your own.

639
00:39:52.920 --> 00:39:56.199
You can literally just write in your journal at the

640
00:39:56.280 --> 00:39:58.639
end of the day, did I have a strong intuitive

641
00:39:58.679 --> 00:40:03.480
sense around anything today? Did I follow it? Did it

642
00:40:03.519 --> 00:40:04.000
work out?

643
00:40:05.599 --> 00:40:05.920
Did I?

644
00:40:05.960 --> 00:40:07.599
You know, if someone does that every day for a

645
00:40:07.639 --> 00:40:10.920
month then reads back through the whole thing, they will

646
00:40:10.960 --> 00:40:16.039
get a powerful lesson. Now that takes determination to do that, willingness,

647
00:40:16.559 --> 00:40:18.480
not giving up after four days and going well, this

648
00:40:18.519 --> 00:40:21.800
is just nonsense, which is what we often. You know,

649
00:40:22.239 --> 00:40:24.920
when I started journaling, every page was this is nonsense.

650
00:40:24.960 --> 00:40:28.639
Why are they're making me do this? Well, it's nonsense.

651
00:40:28.679 --> 00:40:30.440
In my head, I have to live with my own head.

652
00:40:30.679 --> 00:40:33.039
Now I have to write it on paper as well,

653
00:40:33.320 --> 00:40:35.760
and then read it and analyze it and then share

654
00:40:35.800 --> 00:40:39.320
it with my peer group. What you know, all that's

655
00:40:39.360 --> 00:40:41.280
what stuff, but that you know, you get through that.

656
00:40:41.440 --> 00:40:42.719
You get through that and get through that.

657
00:40:43.679 --> 00:40:45.639
And it's tough. It's tough to journal.

658
00:40:45.719 --> 00:40:48.400
I I really, you know. I mean I talk about it.

659
00:40:48.480 --> 00:40:50.559
People talk about it all the time. I believe that

660
00:40:50.679 --> 00:40:53.079
is helpful, but you're not. For me, it's really tough

661
00:40:53.119 --> 00:40:55.360
to journal. How do I how do I get to

662
00:40:55.400 --> 00:40:59.360
the point where I literally can start journaling? Because I

663
00:40:59.440 --> 00:41:02.559
believe you're saying that it can be so effective in

664
00:41:02.639 --> 00:41:03.519
so many ways.

665
00:41:04.480 --> 00:41:07.119
You just have to keep going. You have to first

666
00:41:07.719 --> 00:41:09.480
if that's what's going on with you. And again I've

667
00:41:09.480 --> 00:41:14.519
done this with numerous people. I said, right, find a

668
00:41:14.559 --> 00:41:18.000
point in the day every day for five to five

669
00:41:18.079 --> 00:41:20.920
let's say five or ten minutes, say ten minutes, bolt

670
00:41:20.920 --> 00:41:23.000
it onto something else that you know you have to do.

671
00:41:23.480 --> 00:41:27.159
I mean, I do my journaling. I've eaten breakfast. Before

672
00:41:27.199 --> 00:41:29.719
I get up from breakfast, I write in my germ

673
00:41:30.079 --> 00:41:32.480
it's happening whilst I'm sitting there. For ten minutes after

674
00:41:32.480 --> 00:41:35.719
I've eaten, which is a good idea anyway. Right, So

675
00:41:36.079 --> 00:41:40.159
that's an example. So every day you just sit there

676
00:41:40.199 --> 00:41:44.400
and you write, and if you're not into it, you

677
00:41:44.480 --> 00:41:48.440
write about being not into it. You write about that.

678
00:41:49.559 --> 00:41:52.199
And what do you write about when you're journaling? For instance,

679
00:41:52.400 --> 00:41:56.159
now when I say I don't journal practically every day,

680
00:41:56.159 --> 00:41:59.280
but at least every week, I am sitting and writing

681
00:41:59.440 --> 00:42:03.239
down time that I've had. You know, perhaps is it

682
00:42:03.280 --> 00:42:05.800
intentionally to be a blog or those type of things.

683
00:42:06.280 --> 00:42:07.559
Is journally Does that.

684
00:42:07.480 --> 00:42:11.719
Include the intuition, the inspiration that we get that we

685
00:42:11.760 --> 00:42:14.480
want to write down for ourselves, or does it only

686
00:42:14.480 --> 00:42:18.480
include talk about what happened today or yesterday and so

687
00:42:18.559 --> 00:42:19.320
on and so forth.

688
00:42:20.280 --> 00:42:23.880
You can, you can include whatever you like. You know,

689
00:42:24.199 --> 00:42:26.800
I think that the first kind of barrier to get

690
00:42:26.800 --> 00:42:30.320
through is the barrier of resistance to doing it at all.

691
00:42:31.360 --> 00:42:35.199
That's the first thing people have to encounter. And if

692
00:42:35.239 --> 00:42:39.159
people are willing to explore that resistance, they will encounter

693
00:42:39.280 --> 00:42:42.760
all of those other things because that resistance is the

694
00:42:42.800 --> 00:42:46.239
reason resistance is so difficult to get through is because

695
00:42:46.280 --> 00:42:49.760
it's made of many things all bound in together. So

696
00:42:51.000 --> 00:42:53.559
the more we write about our resistance, the more we

697
00:42:53.639 --> 00:42:56.840
find out what it's about. So someone might find out

698
00:42:57.480 --> 00:43:01.679
that part of that resistance journaling is they were overly

699
00:43:01.679 --> 00:43:05.480
criticized as a child for the way they wrote their handwriting,

700
00:43:06.400 --> 00:43:10.239
or criticized for the content of their writing, or because

701
00:43:10.280 --> 00:43:13.000
they believe that people who write in journals are new

702
00:43:13.039 --> 00:43:18.199
ag and a bit suspect, or because they think I'm

703
00:43:18.239 --> 00:43:20.559
a mature adult now I shouldn't have to do this,

704
00:43:21.320 --> 00:43:24.559
or they think they're too busy. You know, there'll be

705
00:43:24.599 --> 00:43:28.920
all sorts of bits and pieces that are inside that

706
00:43:28.960 --> 00:43:32.559
sort of mess of resistance in the person, and by

707
00:43:32.599 --> 00:43:35.719
writing about that and you start to get The other thing,

708
00:43:35.719 --> 00:43:37.480
of course, is if you hire a coach to help

709
00:43:37.519 --> 00:43:41.639
you actually in a coaching session. Let's say you have

710
00:43:41.639 --> 00:43:44.920
a coaching session once a week. You can say to

711
00:43:44.960 --> 00:43:47.800
the coach I want to get into journaling. Coach will say, great,

712
00:43:47.800 --> 00:43:49.679
I will help you do that. I will teach you

713
00:43:49.679 --> 00:43:52.079
how to do it. I will have you do some

714
00:43:52.519 --> 00:43:55.559
journaling while you're in this session and then discuss with

715
00:43:55.599 --> 00:43:57.159
me how you experience that.

716
00:43:58.039 --> 00:43:59.000
So is there a difference.

717
00:43:59.159 --> 00:44:04.199
Is there a difference between journaling typing versus handwriting?

718
00:44:04.920 --> 00:44:08.519
I personally think there is a difference. I know that

719
00:44:08.559 --> 00:44:10.960
these days, a lot of people are more comfortable with typing.

720
00:44:12.480 --> 00:44:15.760
I've actually tried both for journaling just as an experiment,

721
00:44:16.760 --> 00:44:22.760
and for me, handwriting is much more organic because the

722
00:44:22.800 --> 00:44:27.159
thing with handwriting is that the shape of the writing

723
00:44:28.000 --> 00:44:30.360
and the way the writing is slanting, and the size

724
00:44:30.400 --> 00:44:32.239
of it and the way it sits on the page

725
00:44:33.039 --> 00:44:39.719
is so flexible, and that's very helpful. I think. You know,

726
00:44:39.760 --> 00:44:41.960
if you look back through a journal with full of handwriting,

727
00:44:42.000 --> 00:44:45.440
you can see right that writing is like really tight,

728
00:44:45.719 --> 00:44:48.800
or that writing there is really expressive, or that writing

729
00:44:49.320 --> 00:44:52.000
you know, it allows more. I think it easier for

730
00:44:52.119 --> 00:44:56.199
more to come through with handwriting. But you know, if

731
00:44:56.239 --> 00:44:59.000
handwriting to someone who's just really difficult because they only

732
00:44:59.039 --> 00:45:05.400
ever do typing, maybe they have to start with typing.

733
00:45:05.679 --> 00:45:07.320
One of the ways that I've done it is on

734
00:45:07.360 --> 00:45:11.559
my iPad. I will actually speak and using a program

735
00:45:11.599 --> 00:45:15.119
that then types it, and I find then that's even

736
00:45:15.199 --> 00:45:18.480
more fulfilling for me because I'm really speaking the words

737
00:45:19.079 --> 00:45:21.840
that are coming to my heart, and as that goes

738
00:45:21.880 --> 00:45:25.400
onto the screen, it's like, oh wow, okay, that's what

739
00:45:25.480 --> 00:45:27.280
I really feel. In fact, I find that when I

740
00:45:27.360 --> 00:45:30.920
do that, more genuine feelings come out than when I'm

741
00:45:30.960 --> 00:45:34.800
sitting in either handwriting or typing. But anyway, here we are,

742
00:45:35.119 --> 00:45:38.119
and my goodness, time has gone by and we have

743
00:45:38.239 --> 00:45:41.440
had a chance to talk to about so many incredible things.

744
00:45:42.119 --> 00:45:46.119
As we close, Catherine, what would be a message that

745
00:45:46.159 --> 00:45:49.280
you'd like to share with the audience that you think

746
00:45:49.360 --> 00:45:52.719
could be something that will stay with them after they

747
00:45:52.800 --> 00:45:53.960
finished listening today?

748
00:45:54.840 --> 00:45:58.960
I think, kind of inspired by our conversation today, I'd

749
00:45:59.000 --> 00:46:05.079
like to say that nobody actually has to change. Most

750
00:46:05.119 --> 00:46:09.480
of us are really great as we are, and that

751
00:46:09.519 --> 00:46:12.440
the motive to try and make ourselves be better is

752
00:46:12.480 --> 00:46:16.800
worth questioning. So even if someone just next time they

753
00:46:16.800 --> 00:46:19.480
would decided that there's something wrong with them, they got

754
00:46:19.480 --> 00:46:22.960
to get better, even though they just question that, that

755
00:46:22.960 --> 00:46:27.400
can be incredibly liberating and transforming for somebody. And the

756
00:46:27.440 --> 00:46:30.400
second thing I'd like to say is give things a try.

757
00:46:30.920 --> 00:46:33.639
Trust your intuition of what you want to try, and

758
00:46:33.719 --> 00:46:35.960
trust your intuition as to whether it resonates with you

759
00:46:36.079 --> 00:46:36.280
or not.

760
00:46:38.719 --> 00:46:41.920
All right, how do people find you?

761
00:46:43.480 --> 00:46:46.119
They can tune into my podcast they'd be very welcome.

762
00:46:46.679 --> 00:46:52.039
It's Truth and Transcendence, or they can go to my website,

763
00:46:52.119 --> 00:46:54.960
which is Beingspace dot world.

764
00:46:56.559 --> 00:46:58.440
Okay, and spell that out for me.

765
00:47:00.119 --> 00:47:05.800
I N G S P A C E dot W O.

766
00:47:06.039 --> 00:47:11.239
R l D. Wonderful Catherine, thanks so much. This is

767
00:47:11.400 --> 00:47:12.639
this has been fascinating.

768
00:47:13.360 --> 00:47:15.519
Thank you. I've had so much fun. Thank you very much.

769
00:47:15.800 --> 00:47:18.519
Oh and I have two folks. Thanks for listening. And

770
00:47:18.719 --> 00:47:21.079
I hope you've really enjoyed this. And reach out and

771
00:47:21.079 --> 00:47:23.159
get a little bit more information. I think you'll find

772
00:47:23.159 --> 00:47:26.119
out very valuable. This is a doctor Doug saying, have

773
00:47:26.199 --> 00:47:28.159
a wonderful time and no mistay