Gasping for Air

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This program is designed to provide general
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services of competent professionals before applying or
trying any suggested ideas. At the end

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of the day, it's not about
what you have or even what you've accomplished.

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It's about what you've done with those
accomplishments. It's about who you've lifted

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up, who you've made better.
It's about what you've given back. Denzel

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Washington, welcome to Inspire Vision.
Our sole purpose is to elevate the lives

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of others and to inspire you to
do the same. Dana, welcome to

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the show. Thank you for having
me. Hey, I really appree.

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So one question, I'm just looking
right now your name on the screen versus

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the Daz which is the name that
you use for your book and so forth.

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So who are you? That's the
question of the day. I always

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joke that I have I have two
personalities. So Dana SDAs actually Dana Diaz

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is my birth name, so you
know, you'd have to read the book

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to understand. But I just wanted
to go back to my roots and just

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be who I was born to be, you know, and go back to

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that authentic, first original version of
Dana. But the S Dana SDAs the

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S is my nod to my current
husband, who has just miraculously just shown

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up in my life at exactly the
right time and is my best friend and

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my everything, and so you know, I wanted to acknowledge that because I

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am very proud to be his wife, and I'm proud of myself for after

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literally forty five years of enduring multiple
abuses by multiple people, I am so

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glad that I'm not that broken,
so called damaged person that people refer to

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themselves as when they come out of
those circumstances, Because I mean, am

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I perfect? No? Do I
still make mistakes? Do I maybe disregulate

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here and there? Yeah? Sure, why not? But I am so

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so much further in my healing because
I acknowledge that I'm a human being and

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that I have a right to feel
what I feel, and that it's okay

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to not always be perfect, and
it's okay to take a personal day here

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and there to reset, and you
know, so I think it's good to

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think of ourselves as healthy, whole
humans, no manage Okay, okay,

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So what I'm luck for you to
do is just introduce yourself to the audience.

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You know, besides what you said, how did you get to the

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point that you are today and what
motivated you to write your book Gasping for

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Air. So if you could share
that with the audience and your story there,

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I think that would be fantastic.
Yeah, absolutely, there's a lot

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there. You know, just to
briefly touch upon my childhood, which is

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basically what led me into my former
marriage, which is what Gasping for Air

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is about. I was born to
a teenage mother back in the seventies when

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it was not okay to be an
unwed teenage mother. I was obviously not

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planned, but she wasn't very excited
about my arrival. She actually had her

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tubes tied immediately after I was born, and from then on I was treated

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very much like the accident that I
was referred to being, and like the

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mistake. And you know, then
she married a man who was physically and

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verbally abusive. Told me every day
how deficient I was in some way and

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that nobody would ever love me.
My mother didn't even love me. I

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was a burden of bothering, competence
and everything else. So naturally I got

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the heck out of that house as
soon as I could legally do so.

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But I didn't know it at the
time, but I was a people pleasing

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codependent. I mean, of course
I was, because I was looking for

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any crumb of affection and attention.
I was starving for love. So the

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opening chapter of my book, Gasping
for Air, which is about my former

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twenty five year long relationship which led
into marriage, you know, it opens

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with when I first first met my
ex husband. And the really interesting thing

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when I looked back on it was
that right from the beginning, I mean,

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we barely said hello to each other, but just the nonverbal cues I

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was getting from him definitely reminded me
me of my abusive stepfather. I was

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like the Will Robinson, you know, the robot from Loss in Space,

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was like warning me in my head, danger, danger, like don't do

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it. But I did it because
even though he was aloof and even though

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he was arrogant and had this sense
of entitlement that he didn't outwardly seem to

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deserve. He was giving me a
little attention, and that little attention was

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enough for me to latch onto and
grab and hold on for dear life.

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So then when he's immediately following this, you know, very you know,

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standoffish behavior with you know, it's
you and me against the world. I'll

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love you forever. You know.
I was young, I was desperate,

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and it was he was telling me
everything I wanted to hear, and I

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fell for it, but thus ensued
twenty five years of what we call narcissistic

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abuse. I did not know what
a narcissist was back then, I didn't

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even know what a narcissistic abuse was. But I certainly went through the ringer

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with it after twenty five years,
so much so that it made me sick,

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which is exactly the reason I was
motivated to write the book, because

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at the end of the marriage,
I ended up autoimmune. I ended up

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with a rare lung syndrome called upper
airway resistance syndrome that was all a result

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of having accelerated levels of cortisol,
a stress hormone, running through my body

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for so long, for decades,
and it just made me sick. My

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body turned on me in the end
as well. And I think it's really

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important for people to understand that even
if somebody does not lay a finger on

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you, they can't affect your mental
health and your physical health long term for

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the rest of your life. Well. And it's really interesting as you talk

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about stress, cortisol levels and so
forth, right, and we don't realize

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that so often those illnesses that we
experience in our lives are really resolved a

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result of those emotions that oftentimes are
very hidden, you know, and subconscious

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and so forth. But what I
find fascinating, and I'd like you to

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address this a little bit more,
and I think you've hit on a really

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important point is that you literally attracted
yourself to the very same experience that you

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had as a child. As you've
considered this and pondered this, and that's

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that's kind of a universal thing that
I have discovered as I've interviewed various people

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and so forth. What what do
you think causes that? Why is it

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that we keep attracting the same people? And as you use the word codependent,

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and I understand that, why is
it that we keep attracting the same

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type of people that we want to
avoid until at some point, i'm such

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as yourself, you were able to
finally get out of it. Well,

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I think there's three very easy answers
to it, one of which kind of

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throws people off. So I'll leave
that to the end. But I think

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one the obvious reason is familiarity.
I mean, we tend towards familiar I

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didn't know anything but chaos and mistreatment
and neglect. And you know, my

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needs didn't matter. What I needed
didn't matter. It never did, it

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never would. Why would I think
it would matter in an adult relationship.

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So it was familiar to me.
I knew how to handle it, whether

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it was healthy or not. I
understood it. The other aspect of that

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is the fact that this is what
generational trauma is. You see, I

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watched my mother and able excuse and
tolerate for years my whole life. Her

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husband would say or do something that
was atrocio and she would just keep washing

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the dishes or turn the other way. And if I mean I was very

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tenacious, I was very strong welled. You might get that from me,

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but I would go out to her
and address her and say, just acknowledge

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it you just saw that you were
five feet away, and she would just

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say, oh, we don't talk
about that, or well, just don't

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provoke him. So I called that
enabling, excusing, and tolerating. But

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then her mother did it because my
mother's father was a drunk and he was

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abusive. He put it gunder her
head when she was a little girl.

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She thought she was going to die. That is not okay to happen in

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any house. But did my grandma
do anything about it? No? So,

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I mean, I don't know how
many generations this goes back, but

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we learned we were teaching our daughters
and sons, as the case maybe to

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react to situations in a certain way, and then we teach the next generation

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and so forth. So in those
ways, I didn't know any better.

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And then the third reason, the
one that throws people off, goes back

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to that Cortisol. Actually, what
people don't get is that you could have

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brought me a very nice young man, a perfect dream of a young man,

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and I wouldn't have known what to
do with that, With a guy

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who opened doors for me and spoke
with me, spoke to me with respect

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and had intelligence, And what would
I do with that? What would I

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have possibly done. I didn't know
how to deal with that. That wasn't

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normal to me. It would have
probably bored me. I do believe,

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and I have read, you know, studies about this. You can actually

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become in a sense, addicted,
for lack of better words, to that

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cortisol. It had been running through
me at such high rates. When it

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wasn't running through me, I even
found I would stir stuff up. I

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would stir up trouble or conflict or
an argument because I needed that rush of

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cortisol. And I've even read that
it can be transferred from a mother to

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the fetus, which you know,
I don't know enough about that. I'm

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not a scientist, but it's an
interesting aspect to consider because our biology,

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our chemistry, actually does contribute to
some of the things that we do in

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our life and some of the decisions
we make, even if we're not aware

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of it. Well, and you
know what that is so true. It's

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really interesting when you start talking about
epigenetics and how many of these things transfer

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over. But the beautiful thing about
that, as far as I understand it,

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is that you can take that and
change it. And I tell the

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story in my family you know,
my dad passed away back in twenty ten,

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a wonderful man, very successful in
his life and so forth. But

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it was interesting. We were never
spanked. Now, there's six kids in

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my family, and you know,
they had six children and five of them

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are boys. So you can imagine
the stress that we put my parents through,

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but never never spanked. And it
wasn't until later I discovered that my

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dad had had a belt taken to
him often as a child by his dad.

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And he literally and my mom literally
either consciously subconsciously, I don't know,

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because we never talked about it,
but they literally changed the epigenetics of

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that particular item. Because now,
and I'm pretty pretty confident of this,

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none of my brothers or my sister
ever have really spanked their children in a

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way that was would be considered abusive. I never spanked my children, and

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so it's interesting, and I think
it's important to realize that we can change

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that. And you're right, it's
generational, but we can change that if

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we so choose to do that,
if we're brave enough to do it.

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I agree it's a choice. It
is. So i'd love for you to

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based on your experience and studies and
so forth, define narcissism because I hear

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about narcissism and everyone he's a narcissist, she's a narcissist, and so forth.

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To find in your mind what is
a narcissist? And number one number

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two are their levels? You know, Is it like a ladder where you

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know, there's step number one,
step number two and then you got to

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the very top. Yeah. Absolutely, I you know, narcissism is so

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complex, so I try to keep
it simple for people. There is definitely

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a spectrum of it, you know, where you have the low level narcissists,

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and these are your basic They're actually
what narcissists are meant to be,

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because narcissist comes from the name of
the Greek god narcissists who like to look

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at his reflection in the water.
And so these are the people we see

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on social media that have to take
a selfie every two seconds, and they

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usually look as good as they think
they do, so they're not bothering anybody.

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They might annoy you, but they're
really not doing, you know,

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causing any trouble with it. But
on the very far end of things,

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you know, you have what we
call malignant narcissists. I actually liken it

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to tumors a lot of the time. You know, your person that's posting

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all those selfies, they're like a
benign tumor. They're not bothering you,

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it's just there. But those malignant
tumors they cause you problems, they might

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even kill you. These are the
people that comprise, you know, twenty

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some percent of the US prison population. These are the people that nine times

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out of ten are involved in domestic
violence situations. These are the dangerous ones.

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And certainly there are, as you
said, levels in between, because

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it is on a spectrum. There
are narcissistic qualities. We can list,

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you know, dozens of them.
But just because you have some, and

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I want to be clear about this, does not mean you're a narcissist,

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because you know, here's another flip
of the coin is people like me who

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have come from backgrounds where you are
abused can tend to have narcissistic qualities.

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But where I have learned to draw
the line is what the intent is.

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If I am trying to control a
situation, it is because it helps me,

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it feels safe because in the past, you know, I don't like

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surprises. I don't like the unexpected. I like to know and expective I

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can control something which I'm aware of, so I don't do as much anymore.

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But it's a matter of making myself
feel safe, so I don't feel

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threatened and I don't feel like somebody
is going to assault me. But a

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narcissist, their intent is to harm
you. Their intent is to cause you

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pain or as you financial loss,
or cause you, you know, mental

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torments. So I always say,
if there is intentional harm involved, you

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are dealing with a malignant person.
And you know, there are some people

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that don't even believe in narcissism,
and that's fine. I always say,

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you know, a bad person's a
bad person, and abuse is abuse.

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If you're intentionally harming somebody, that's
just morally wrong. It is morally corrupted,

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and there's a problem. Well,
and you talk and I like the

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word you use, but you talk
about the malignant narcissist, which is at

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that level. And as you say, and I had no idea, but

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twenty percent of those in prison are
at that level. So you have that,

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but you also have those medium ones
that still can cause great difficulty in

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relationships because they're so focused on themselves, and I smile. I have a

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lot of friends that love to do
their selfies and post them and so forth,

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And you're right, you know it's
cute, you can laugh about it

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and so forth, and it's not
affecting anyone. And yet you get to

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you start to move up that bridge
a bit, and all of a sudden

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you've got someone who is kind of
wanting to make sure that it's done their

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way. They don't want to really
allow you to do what you want to

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really want to be able to do. So there are those different levels,

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and at what point in time do
we say, you know, what this

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is at a level that's going to
be damaging to a relationship. Yeah,

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and you know that's a personal choice, unfortunately, because I even look at

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just you know, taking my former
relationship, my former marriage. For example,

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my sister who I have by my
biological father. She was raised by

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our biological father. I was not. She would have never even spent one

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second with my ex husband because she
was raised, you know, to have

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healthy self esteem and to set boundaries
and to feel good and confident and assert

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herself in all these things. I
was not raised that way. So it's

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a perspective. You know, what
one person will tolerate and endure is different

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from the next. But I think
anytime it is causing you, you know,

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like for me, I noticed in
my childhood it was stomach aches and

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headaches, and now I just forget, you know, I feel like it's

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whodoo voodoo. But you know,
I can feel somebody's energy. If somebody

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is just making me feel uneasy,
whether you call that your gut feeling or

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whatever you want to call it,
I just say, maybe they're not your

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person, and it's okay not to
have a reason, you know, to

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justify that or substantiate that. It's
okay. Not everybody is meant to get

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along, even if it's your family, because that's the problem with narcissism,

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it's it's everywhere. It can be
family. I have no contact with my

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mother and stepfather. You know how
much that hurts not have my mother in

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my life. But she doesn't want
to do that. Her narcissist husband put

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a divide between us, and she
told me she cannot be my mother and

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his wife all at the same time. Okay, I had a friend who

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was a narcissist. You know,
the jealousy shows up. I had a

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coworker who was a narcissist, always
stealing ideas, taking credit for work that

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I did, you know, stuff
like that. So we see it all

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around us. I mean even on
the playground that you see the kids,

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there's always that dominant kid who's bullying
everybody and who everybody's a little fearful of.

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That's a little narcissist. So you
know, we can't avoid it.

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Well, then, and you bring
up something very interesting, and I had

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thought about this jealousy. Jealousy in
your mind? Is that an indication of

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narcissism to some degree? They think
it's a very strong indication because when I

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look at the different narcissists and see
patterns and just you know, I mean

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years of hearing everybody else's stories.
One thing that's ironic is that some narcissists

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actually do have a very healthy self
esteem. They think they actually do think

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they're superior to everybody else. But
a lot of narcissists, ironically, they

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have none of that. They are
very insecure, and they outwardly try to

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get that admiration in praise because they
don't feel it inside themselves. So I

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think that that need to you know, do. Whatever it is they're doing

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to other people, that harm that
they're causing is coming out of jealousy.

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I know I've had it done to
me, But it's usually that they're jealous

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that you have a certain personality type
or quality about you that they wish they

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had, or maybe you have I
don't know, some aspect of your life

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is envious to them, but there's
something about you that just bothers their spirit,

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and so they just want to take
you down. They want to make

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sure that you suffer in some way
for the injustice that they feel that they

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weren't endowed with whatever it is that
you have that they so desired. So

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it's it's strange how it works well. And you know, coming from a

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medical background, obviously, you know, I've always looked at what is the

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root cause of whatever. I was
a dentist, but I used to focus

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on people who had had a neck
pain, and so I would go in

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and really look, what's the root
cause, what are the muscles, what's

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the neurological relationship here that's going on. So you look at narcissism. And

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I like the jealousy concept because if
someone recognizes that they're jealous of someone for

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whatever reason, and they think that
they're out making too many friends of the

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opposite sex, or or you know, they have a job that they don't

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have or whatever that is. How
does a narcissist number one recognize what are

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some indications that they can consciously recognize
is going on? And then how do

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they help themselves to become less narcissistic
so that not only do they experience a

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better life, that those around them
experience a better life. Any thoughts on

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that, Oh, I have a
lot of thoughts on that, but it

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comes down to one thought. A
true narcissist, a true malignant narcissist,

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they have no self awareness, they
have no remorse. They feel one hundred

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percent justified in treating people the way
they do. That's where the problem lies.

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So you will never get them to
the point they would never even consider

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the fact that there's some improvement they
need to make to improve their lives.

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If anything, they will just blame
it. And they're known to blame everybody

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else for whatever, you know,
bad luck or you know, things that

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happen that don't go according to the
way they wanted them to. Whatever it

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is that doesn't you know, happen
for them, it's always somebody else's fault.

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They don't have the ability, their
ego cannot withstand that offense or the

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possibility that they might be less than
in some way. I know I'm stuttering,

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but it's just it's hard for me
to imagine being that type of a

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person that just honestly cannot see,
you know, accountability in anything. But

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that's how these really true narcissists are
because I always tell people people are so

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scared of being a narcissist, and
I always say, well, if you're

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worried about being a narcissist, you're
not a narcissist. Because a narcissist,

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a real one, is going to
say, I'm not a narcissist, you're

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the narcissist. Well, and you're
talking about the malignant narcissist. But I'm

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asking, I'm asking. You know, in relationships, oftentimes you see the

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different types of things. As you
were saying, jealousy was the one that

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kind of hit me. But how
does an individual recognize you know, they're

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going along and all of a sudden
they recognize, Wow, I'm experiencing that

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emotion of jealousy to the point that
it's probably not a healthy emotion to have.

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How do they? So they're probably
maybe what a quarter to a halfway

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up that ladder towards the malignancy.
Oh, at least at that point,

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they're halfway there. Yeah, how
do they? How do they overcome that?

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Because I believe everyone has the ability
to some degree to be able to

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overcome some of those emotional challenges that
are affecting not only themselves but others.

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So I think that if somebody is
aware of their emotions and aware that they

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would like to, you know,
they decide they want to improve something,

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I agree that they can overcome it. I however, do not believe a

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really malignant narcissist is going to forget
of self awareness or accountability. But for

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those that over to middle section that
do want to overcome it, I think

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it's like anything else, like any
of us that want to improve some mental

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health situation, Just like you know, when I was trying to heal myself,

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you know, from triggers and panic
attacks and all these awful things that

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come with a life of abuse.
It's a matter of just knowing when that

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when that situation is striking, recognizing
it, and you almost I always say

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it's like in your head. You
have the crossroads where you can go this

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way or that way, and you
ought to medically go that way, because

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every time you've been in this situation, you go that way. You tend

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towards the jealousy, or you tend
towards the control or whatever it is,

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and you have to learn to force
yourself the other way until it gets you

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know, easy enough and where you're
used to it enough where you automatically go

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that way. It's just like when
you're regulating yourself, like I said,

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from a panic attack or any kind
of anxiety that you know, one might

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feel. It's the same thing.
Or even when I've been in those situations

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where I've had to stop myself and
say, Okay, this is silly that

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I'm trying to control this situation so
that i can feel safe, because usually

325
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whatever it is is very menial and
meaningless in the scheme of life and in

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the scheme of the situation. To
just step back and say, you know

327
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what, I'm going to be okay
if this person does it that way,

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I'm going to be okay. You
know, the jealous person might say,

329
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if you know this and have a
vehicle of a certain brand, that I

330
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would like to have. Maybe I
should work harder to get that. You

331
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know, of course you can overcome
it. It's just a matter of rewiring

332
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your brain to think differently and to
come at it from a different perspective instead

333
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of enving something or wishing something.
Figure out what you you know, say

334
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it's okay for them to have it, for me to have this, for

335
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me to have what I want.
This is what I need to do,

336
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and I can go about it a
different way. Good. You know,

337
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you you talk about something that I
that I want to share and ask you

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about because you talk about, you
know, knowing many brief experiences of people

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who have been able to release the
shame that they carry within themselves and have

340
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the strength to remove themselves from that
toxic relationship. So that's an interesting approach

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because what you're saying is that there
is that sense of personal responsibility that they

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need to be able to release that
shame that has allowed them to get into

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and stay within that abusive, narcissistic
relationship. So talk a little bit about

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that. What are some of those
experiences that you've observed with people that you've

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worked with and so forth on how
how are they able to do that releasing

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shame. I again, I think
it's a matter of perspective because you know,

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I know, for me, when
I was starting my healing, I

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was carrying the shame. I thought
I was the shameful thing because everybody had

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told me that I was. And
you know, so it's a matter of

350
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turning it around and saying, wait
a second. All these people who who

351
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did what they did to me or
said what they said to me, whatever

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it is, it's because that there
was something they weren't willing to face,

353
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some trauma, some terrible situation in
their lives that they have not addressed yet.

354
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It's their unhealed trauma. But instead
of dealing with it, they put

355
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it on me. They burdened me
with it. They kind of, you

356
00:29:12.079 --> 00:29:17.079
know, I kind of looked at
it like I was the scapegoat for everybody

357
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else's shame that they had carried.
But once I realized it wasn't about me,

358
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I could then work on improving myself
in starting with myself talk. I

359
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am not going to talk to myself
like other people talk to me. I

360
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deserve better than that, you know, realizing my worth that I was allowed

361
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to have love just like anyone else. You know, it just pains me

362
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when I hear I always hear these
people, I'm unlovable, I'm broken,

363
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I'm damaged. It just that hurts
my soul because nobody is broken and unlovable.

364
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Some might be harder to love than
others. I mean, granted,

365
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like a narcissist who is malignant,
but there's so people out there that will

366
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love that person. And I mean
that's what mothers are for, right,

367
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So you know, I think it's
just a matter of really, I mean,

368
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you have to be very self aware. You have to want to go

369
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on that journey with yourself to find
out where where it hits you hard and

370
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where that where that stuff lies.
I always say, it's kind of like

371
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digging up a rose bush. You
know, on the surface, you think,

372
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oh, the rose bush is,
you know, prickling me with thorn.

373
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It's the rose bush's fault. It's
my ex husband that abused me and

374
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my stepfather abused me. Well guess
what, I can cut that thing off

375
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and then it's not prickling me with
its thorns. But if I want to

376
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dig it up out of the ground
and really get to it, I'm digging

377
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and I'm digging, and boy,
every time I think I got to the

378
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bottom, there's more. It keeps
going down, all the way down to

379
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its roots. And anyone who's ever
dug up a rose bush understands what I'm

380
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talking about. It's for let listen
and listen awful, and that's what healing

381
00:30:59.240 --> 00:31:02.440
looks like. But if you're willing
to do the work, you know,

382
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you will find out things about yourself
that will give you that information and that

383
00:31:07.839 --> 00:31:11.319
depth that you need to know where
you gotta you know, I always say

384
00:31:11.359 --> 00:31:15.759
it's like having two wires up here. Like I said that crossroads, Like

385
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I always go down this road,
I want to go down a different road.

386
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I want to try that one and
see if that works better. Because

387
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nobody wants to feel, you know, any of the negative feelings they feel,

388
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or have any of the negative reactions
they have to to people in life.

389
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And you know, we don't want
to sweat and get panicky and have

390
00:31:34.559 --> 00:31:38.960
our heart racing and that's no fun. And I don't really believe that any

391
00:31:40.200 --> 00:31:44.440
good human being wants to really hurt
other human beings. So, you know,

392
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if we can be better, I
think people forget that your mental health,

393
00:31:48.440 --> 00:31:53.039
you know, is what feeds into
your life every day, into every

394
00:31:53.039 --> 00:31:57.759
word that comes out of your mouth, into every action you do. And

395
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you know, we're so consumed do
with physical health. You know, oh,

396
00:32:00.839 --> 00:32:04.480
you want to lose weight, you
want to get muscles, you're lifting

397
00:32:04.519 --> 00:32:07.920
weights, you're running, you're walking. But what do we do for our

398
00:32:07.960 --> 00:32:10.079
mental health. It's like we ignore
it and just think, oh, well,

399
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you know somebody else's fault. I'm
not going to deal with it,

400
00:32:14.119 --> 00:32:16.599
or I'll drink some beers and swallow
my product. You know, it doesn't

401
00:32:16.640 --> 00:32:22.599
work that way. You have to
actually be very aware and invested in your

402
00:32:22.640 --> 00:32:28.759
mental health and work it out daily, whether it's through meditation or whether it's

403
00:32:28.799 --> 00:32:31.640
through some sort of therapy or journaling
or whatever it is that you do.

404
00:32:32.599 --> 00:32:36.599
You know, to get in touch
with yourself and to know how you feel

405
00:32:36.599 --> 00:32:40.160
and know why you feel that way
and how you can be better. That's

406
00:32:40.200 --> 00:32:45.079
where your change comes. That's where
learning, growth and change come. Well,

407
00:32:45.119 --> 00:32:50.440
and I think you've said something really
important and it goes to perception.

408
00:32:50.559 --> 00:32:54.680
This concept of perception. You know, it's interesting. You know I've used

409
00:32:54.680 --> 00:33:00.079
this examply for so here's five people
at an intersection and then there's an accident,

410
00:33:00.720 --> 00:33:05.839
and if you ask each individual what
happened, You're going to get a

411
00:33:05.839 --> 00:33:09.960
different story because they have their perception
based on whatever that happens to be.

412
00:33:10.200 --> 00:33:15.920
So, as a child, your
perception is is when someone says you're no

413
00:33:15.039 --> 00:33:22.279
good or blah blah blah, your
perception is is that's true and what you

414
00:33:22.400 --> 00:33:29.440
said, I think is so important
recognizing that when when someone communicates to you,

415
00:33:29.519 --> 00:33:35.680
they are literally communicating from their own
emotions. It has nothing to do

416
00:33:36.039 --> 00:33:39.200
with you. It has everything to
do with them. I've told people that

417
00:33:39.240 --> 00:33:45.240
I've worked with before that you know
what is if you want to see the

418
00:33:45.279 --> 00:33:49.640
cause of your challenge, lift that
mirror and look at yourself in the mirror

419
00:33:49.759 --> 00:33:52.079
rather than looking at the other person. But then the other thing the other

420
00:33:52.119 --> 00:33:57.359
way around. Turn that mirror around. When someone is saying unkind things to

421
00:33:57.400 --> 00:34:00.559
you, being abusive, being bullying, whatever that happens to be, turn

422
00:34:00.599 --> 00:34:06.000
the marror around and recognize that it's
their problem, it's not your problem.

423
00:34:06.160 --> 00:34:12.480
And I think that's such an important
concept to understand. Yeah, I agree.

424
00:34:12.559 --> 00:34:16.679
I mean that was the beginning of
my healing when I really literally made

425
00:34:16.400 --> 00:34:22.360
that. You don't put that together. It was just realizing that what I

426
00:34:22.559 --> 00:34:28.840
thought was causing me so much mental
angst and thereby physical. It wasn't even

427
00:34:29.000 --> 00:34:31.760
mine, it was everyone else's.
And when I realized that, I was

428
00:34:31.800 --> 00:34:35.840
like, Okay, well I can
deal with my stuff, you know,

429
00:34:35.960 --> 00:34:39.639
because now that I've set down everybody
else's, you know, shame that they've

430
00:34:39.639 --> 00:34:45.719
burdened me with caring. Now I
can just carry my own and it's much

431
00:34:45.840 --> 00:34:49.920
lighter. And if you can go
through life being a good person, doing

432
00:34:49.960 --> 00:34:53.360
the right thing, you know,
doing your best at every opportunity, I

433
00:34:53.400 --> 00:34:58.920
think your conscience is much lighter as
well, and so it's much easier to

434
00:34:58.960 --> 00:35:01.199
go through life that way way.
But it also involves, you know,

435
00:35:01.400 --> 00:35:07.400
definitely. I'm a big believer in
setting boundaries and being assertive. We don't

436
00:35:07.440 --> 00:35:10.920
have to be unkind to do those
things, but I think it's essential for

437
00:35:12.039 --> 00:35:16.159
people to know that this is where
my boundaries are. You're welcome to do

438
00:35:16.199 --> 00:35:22.360
anything within those boundaries. But you
know, if you're not willing to participate,

439
00:35:22.440 --> 00:35:24.480
if you're not willing to play this
game, then you're not my person.

440
00:35:24.599 --> 00:35:29.280
Maybe, and I wish you well, and that's fine. You know,

441
00:35:29.920 --> 00:35:31.199
Like I said, we are not
all meant to get along. And

442
00:35:31.239 --> 00:35:36.960
I think that, you know,
I spent most of my life trying so

443
00:35:37.079 --> 00:35:39.119
hard to be what everybody else wanted
to be, me to be, but

444
00:35:39.280 --> 00:35:44.599
I couldn't be everything. I could
only be me. And that's when my

445
00:35:44.679 --> 00:35:47.320
life started to change. Is when
I realized that at forty four years old,

446
00:35:47.800 --> 00:35:52.199
yeah, time to discover your own
true voice, which I think is

447
00:35:52.239 --> 00:35:55.719
so important. So talk a little
bit more about your book. How do

448
00:35:55.800 --> 00:36:01.840
people find your book? And and
this really is about you, So what

449
00:36:02.559 --> 00:36:07.760
value do people get out of reading
your book? Do you think the value

450
00:36:07.920 --> 00:36:10.480
is is that I don't hold back. I didn't hold back a single thing.

451
00:36:10.960 --> 00:36:15.159
It is very raw. It is
every thought that was in my head

452
00:36:15.639 --> 00:36:22.320
at every moment that you know,
caused me some kind of you know,

453
00:36:22.440 --> 00:36:28.039
mental or physical impression in my life
with my ex husband, it's definitely a

454
00:36:28.199 --> 00:36:34.159
very accurate portrayal of a relationship with
a narcissist as well. But like I

455
00:36:34.199 --> 00:36:40.079
said, it's just a journey from
being that hopeless, devastated. I mean,

456
00:36:40.119 --> 00:36:46.440
at some points I didn't even want
to live anymore to finding out that

457
00:36:47.360 --> 00:36:52.880
I had had the power all along
inside me to love myself. I didn't

458
00:36:52.960 --> 00:36:58.000
need his love, I needed my
love. I needed to respect myself.

459
00:36:58.400 --> 00:37:04.719
I had the power to remove myself
from situations like that marriage that were causing

460
00:37:04.760 --> 00:37:09.800
me so much stress and distress that
it was making me ill. And it's

461
00:37:09.800 --> 00:37:15.559
a beautiful thing that, you know. Part of this journey was, you

462
00:37:15.559 --> 00:37:20.000
know, asking myself what I wanted
because I had relied on what everybody else

463
00:37:20.119 --> 00:37:25.360
was dictating to me my whole life. And narcissists they do control every aspect

464
00:37:25.400 --> 00:37:31.119
of your life. So it's a
rough journey. But and it's a rough

465
00:37:31.199 --> 00:37:35.519
read for some. I have only
had one person say they couldn't finish it

466
00:37:35.559 --> 00:37:38.800
because it was too triggering, But
it's because I thought it was so important

467
00:37:39.320 --> 00:37:45.239
to just give the full experience.
This is not superficial by any means.

468
00:37:45.360 --> 00:37:49.599
If anything, I feel like it
gives voice to the people who have been

469
00:37:49.639 --> 00:37:54.400
in those situations or still are that
don't even know or understand how they feel

470
00:37:54.480 --> 00:37:58.920
or why they feel it. So
I encourage everyone to check it out.

471
00:37:58.960 --> 00:38:04.679
It's called Gasping for Air, The
Stranglehold of Narcissistic Abuse. It is available

472
00:38:04.719 --> 00:38:07.679
anywhere books are sold online. You
can go to my website and click on

473
00:38:07.760 --> 00:38:10.760
the link, or you can go
straight to most people go to Amazon,

474
00:38:10.800 --> 00:38:15.559
and I will say it is also
available on ebook because I know people that

475
00:38:15.639 --> 00:38:20.880
are in abusive situations do not need
a book on their coffee table that has

476
00:38:20.920 --> 00:38:23.159
the word abuse on it. So
you can get it for free if you're

477
00:38:23.199 --> 00:38:28.840
a Kindle number, or just get
it on whatever reading device you have because

478
00:38:28.880 --> 00:38:35.320
it is available in that format well. And I think the key to this

479
00:38:35.920 --> 00:38:40.920
is that you not only explain what
you experienced, but you explain the journey

480
00:38:40.960 --> 00:38:45.239
of how you finally got yourself out
of it. And I think that for

481
00:38:45.400 --> 00:38:52.039
many people being able to read that
gives them a sense of hope and understanding

482
00:38:52.079 --> 00:38:57.800
that yes, they can do it
too. So as we close, what

483
00:38:57.880 --> 00:39:00.920
I'd like for you to do is
just share with the and I know you

484
00:39:00.119 --> 00:39:05.320
probably are going to repeat something that
you've said, but share with the audience

485
00:39:06.280 --> 00:39:13.920
the message from your heart that you'd
like them to understand. I have a

486
00:39:13.960 --> 00:39:16.760
lot of things I like to share
from my heart, but certainly one of

487
00:39:16.800 --> 00:39:22.079
the biggest messages I want people to
know is that you were not meant to

488
00:39:22.119 --> 00:39:27.079
suffer here. I spent my whole
life thinking that maybe that was what I

489
00:39:27.119 --> 00:39:31.920
was meant to be here for.
It's not. And I do absolutely touching

490
00:39:31.960 --> 00:39:37.119
upon what we just spoke about.
I do absolutely want people to see me

491
00:39:37.159 --> 00:39:42.639
as an example of somebody who has
overcome circumstances, who has released who is

492
00:39:43.039 --> 00:39:49.119
by the power in myself and my
love and respect for myself, released myself

493
00:39:49.119 --> 00:39:54.119
from circumstances that were very distressing to
my mental and physical health. I deserved

494
00:39:54.239 --> 00:40:00.199
better. I didn't know I did
until I decided I did. But when

495
00:40:00.239 --> 00:40:04.400
you decide you want more, when
you decide that you're worth more, you

496
00:40:04.440 --> 00:40:06.920
can have it. Because I'm going
to tell you, in just three and

497
00:40:06.920 --> 00:40:13.079
a half short years since my divorce, I have gone from scrubbing toilets and

498
00:40:13.119 --> 00:40:16.440
floors cleaning houses in a podunk town. So now I'm a published author.

499
00:40:16.960 --> 00:40:22.119
I have two more books coming out. I have been on podcasts all over

500
00:40:22.159 --> 00:40:27.599
the world and spoken in summits for
healing and doing everything I wanted to do

501
00:40:28.039 --> 00:40:30.480
since I was, you know,
a teenage girl. I wanted to be

502
00:40:30.559 --> 00:40:35.280
a writer. I wanted to travel. I wanted to help other victims of

503
00:40:35.320 --> 00:40:37.679
abuse, and I'm able to do
that now. So I hope that other

504
00:40:37.719 --> 00:40:42.559
people will find what's true in their
heart. Ask yourself what you want,

505
00:40:43.000 --> 00:40:46.079
See that vision, see that passion, see your goals. Because I promise

506
00:40:46.159 --> 00:40:51.159
you, once you see those things, you won't be able to unsee them,

507
00:40:51.320 --> 00:40:55.800
and you will start enacting the steps
towards achieving them. Wonderful, well

508
00:40:55.920 --> 00:41:00.119
said. Thank you so much for
Dana, Thank you for being vulnerable,

509
00:41:00.239 --> 00:41:04.760
and thank you for being transparent to
the point that you were willing to write

510
00:41:04.800 --> 00:41:07.760
that book because I guarantee you,
and I'm sure you already know this,

511
00:41:07.960 --> 00:41:12.559
that it's going to help numerous people
who will read that book. So I

512
00:41:12.719 --> 00:41:16.320
really appreciate you being on the show. I acknowledge all the good that you're

513
00:41:16.360 --> 00:41:22.360
doing and hope that we'll get you
back on the show again soon. Wonderful.

514
00:41:22.440 --> 00:41:27.239
Thanks for having me your betting folks, Thanks for listening. Hope you

515
00:41:27.360 --> 00:41:30.280
enjoyed it, and please reach out
because you're going to. I think for

516
00:41:30.320 --> 00:41:34.760
those that are experiencing this type of
situation, it can make a difference for

517
00:41:34.840 --> 00:41:38.760
you. So have a great week. This is doctor Doug saying I'm mistake