Gasping for Air

0:01 This program is designed to provide general information with regards to the subject matters covered. This information is given with the understanding that neither the hosts, guests, sponsors, or station are engaged in rendering any specific and personal medical, financial, legal counseling, professional service, or any advice. You should seek the services of competent professionals before applying or trying any suggested ideas. At the end of the day, it's not about what you have or even what you've accomplished. It's about what you've done with those accomplishments. It's about who you've lifted up, who you've made better. It's about what you've given back. Denzel Washington, welcome to Inspire Vision. Our sole purpose is to elevate the lives of others and to inspire you to do the same. Dana, welcome to the show. Thank you for having me. Hey, I really appree.

1:00 So one question, I'm just looking right now your name on the screen versus the Daz which is the name that you use for your book and so forth. So who are you? That's the question of the day. I always joke that I have I have two personalities. So Dana SDAs actually Dana Diaz is my birth name, so you know, you'd have to read the book to understand. But I just wanted to go back to my roots and just be who I was born to be, you know, and go back to that authentic, first original version of Dana. But the S Dana SDAs the S is my nod to my current husband, who has just miraculously just shown up in my life at exactly the right time and is my best friend and my everything, and so you know, I wanted to acknowledge that because I am very proud to be his wife, and I'm proud of myself for after literally forty five years of enduring multiple abuses by multiple people, I am so glad that I'm not that broken, so called damaged person that people refer to themselves as when they come out of those circumstances, Because I mean, am I perfect? No? Do I still make mistakes? Do I maybe disregulate here and there? Yeah? Sure, why not? But I am so so much further in my healing because I acknowledge that I'm a human being and

2:35 that I have a right to feel what I feel, and that it's okay to not always be perfect, and it's okay to take a personal day here and there to reset, and you know, so I think it's good to think of ourselves as healthy, whole humans, no manage Okay, okay, So what I'm luck for you to do is just introduce yourself to the audience. You know, besides what you said, how did you get to the point that you are today and what motivated you to write your book Gasping for Air. So if you could share that with the audience and your story there, I think that would be fantastic. Yeah, absolutely, there's a lot there. You know, just to briefly touch upon my childhood, which is basically what led me into my former marriage, which is what Gasping for Air is about. I was born to a teenage mother back in the seventies when it was not okay to be an unwed teenage mother. I was obviously not planned, but she wasn't very excited about my arrival. She actually had her tubes tied immediately after I was born, and from then on I was treated very much like the accident that I was referred to being, and like the mistake. And you know, then she married a man who was physically and verbally abusive. Told me every day how deficient I was in some way and

4:06 that nobody would ever love me. My mother didn't even love me. I was a burden of bothering, competence and everything else. So naturally I got the heck out of that house as soon as I could legally do so. But I didn't know it at the time, but I was a people pleasing codependent. I mean, of course I was, because I was looking for any crumb of affection and attention. I was starving for love. So the opening chapter of my book, Gasping for Air, which is about my former twenty five year long relationship which led into marriage, you know, it opens with when I first first met my ex husband. And the really interesting thing when I looked back on it was that right from the beginning, I mean, we barely said hello to each other, but just the nonverbal cues I was getting from him definitely reminded me me of my abusive stepfather. I was like the Will Robinson, you know, the robot from Loss in Space, was like warning me in my head, danger, danger, like don't do it. But I did it because even though he was aloof and even though he was arrogant and had this sense of entitlement that he didn't outwardly seem to deserve. He was giving me a little attention, and that little attention was enough for me to latch onto and grab and hold on for dear life.

5:31 So then when he's immediately following this, you know, very you know, standoffish behavior with you know, it's you and me against the world. I'll love you forever. You know. I was young, I was desperate, and it was he was telling me everything I wanted to hear, and I fell for it, but thus ensued twenty five years of what we call narcissistic abuse. I did not know what a narcissist was back then, I didn't even know what a narcissistic abuse was. But I certainly went through the ringer with it after twenty five years, so much so that it made me sick, which is exactly the reason I was motivated to write the book, because at the end of the marriage, I ended up autoimmune. I ended up with a rare lung syndrome called upper airway resistance syndrome that was all a result of having accelerated levels of cortisol, a stress hormone, running through my body for so long, for decades, and it just made me sick. My body turned on me in the end as well. And I think it's really important for people to understand that even if somebody does not lay a finger on you, they can't affect your mental health and your physical health long term for the rest of your life. Well. And it's really interesting as you talk about stress, cortisol levels and so forth, right, and we don't realize that so often those illnesses that we experience in our lives are really resolved a

7:08 result of those emotions that oftentimes are very hidden, you know, and subconscious and so forth. But what I find fascinating, and I'd like you to address this a little bit more, and I think you've hit on a really important point is that you literally attracted yourself to the very same experience that you had as a child. As you've considered this and pondered this, and that's that's kind of a universal thing that I have discovered as I've interviewed various people and so forth. What what do you think causes that? Why is it that we keep attracting the same people? And as you use the word codependent, and I understand that, why is it that we keep attracting the same type of people that we want to avoid until at some point, i'm such as yourself, you were able to finally get out of it. Well, I think there's three very easy answers to it, one of which kind of throws people off. So I'll leave that to the end. But I think one the obvious reason is familiarity. I mean, we tend towards familiar I didn't know anything but chaos and mistreatment and neglect. And you know, my needs didn't matter. What I needed didn't matter. It never did, it never would. Why would I think it would matter in an adult relationship.

8:35 So it was familiar to me. I knew how to handle it, whether it was healthy or not. I understood it. The other aspect of that is the fact that this is what generational trauma is. You see, I watched my mother and able excuse and tolerate for years my whole life. Her husband would say or do something that was atrocio and she would just keep washing the dishes or turn the other way. And if I mean I was very tenacious, I was very strong welled. You might get that from me, but I would go out to her and address her and say, just acknowledge it you just saw that you were five feet away, and she would just say, oh, we don't talk about that, or well, just don't provoke him. So I called that enabling, excusing, and tolerating. But then her mother did it because my mother's father was a drunk and he was abusive. He put it gunder her head when she was a little girl.

9:31 She thought she was going to die. That is not okay to happen in any house. But did my grandma do anything about it? No? So, I mean, I don't know how many generations this goes back, but we learned we were teaching our daughters and sons, as the case maybe to react to situations in a certain way, and then we teach the next generation and so forth. So in those ways, I didn't know any better. And then the third reason, the one that throws people off, goes back to that Cortisol. Actually, what people don't get is that you could have brought me a very nice young man, a perfect dream of a young man, and I wouldn't have known what to do with that, With a guy who opened doors for me and spoke with me, spoke to me with respect and had intelligence, And what would I do with that? What would I have possibly done. I didn't know how to deal with that. That wasn't normal to me. It would have probably bored me. I do believe, and I have read, you know, studies about this. You can actually become in a sense, addicted, for lack of better words, to that cortisol. It had been running through me at such high rates. When it wasn't running through me, I even found I would stir stuff up. I would stir up trouble or conflict or an argument because I needed that rush of cortisol. And I've even read that it can be transferred from a mother to the fetus, which you know, I don't know enough about that. I'm

11:03 not a scientist, but it's an interesting aspect to consider because our biology, our chemistry, actually does contribute to some of the things that we do in our life and some of the decisions we make, even if we're not aware of it. Well, and you know what that is so true. It's really interesting when you start talking about epigenetics and how many of these things transfer over. But the beautiful thing about that, as far as I understand it, is that you can take that and change it. And I tell the story in my family you know, my dad passed away back in twenty ten, a wonderful man, very successful in his life and so forth. But it was interesting. We were never spanked. Now, there's six kids in my family, and you know, they had six children and five of them are boys. So you can imagine the stress that we put my parents through, but never never spanked. And it wasn't until later I discovered that my dad had had a belt taken to him often as a child by his dad.

12:15 And he literally and my mom literally either consciously subconsciously, I don't know, because we never talked about it, but they literally changed the epigenetics of that particular item. Because now, and I'm pretty pretty confident of this, none of my brothers or my sister ever have really spanked their children in a way that was would be considered abusive. I never spanked my children, and so it's interesting, and I think it's important to realize that we can change that. And you're right, it's generational, but we can change that if we so choose to do that, if we're brave enough to do it.

13:00 I agree it's a choice. It is. So i'd love for you to based on your experience and studies and so forth, define narcissism because I hear about narcissism and everyone he's a narcissist, she's a narcissist, and so forth. To find in your mind what is a narcissist? And number one number two are their levels? You know, Is it like a ladder where you know, there's step number one, step number two and then you got to the very top. Yeah. Absolutely, I you know, narcissism is so complex, so I try to keep it simple for people. There is definitely a spectrum of it, you know, where you have the low level narcissists, and these are your basic They're actually what narcissists are meant to be, because narcissist comes from the name of the Greek god narcissists who like to look at his reflection in the water. And so these are the people we see on social media that have to take a selfie every two seconds, and they usually look as good as they think they do, so they're not bothering anybody.

14:11 They might annoy you, but they're really not doing, you know, causing any trouble with it. But on the very far end of things, you know, you have what we call malignant narcissists. I actually liken it to tumors a lot of the time. You know, your person that's posting all those selfies, they're like a benign tumor. They're not bothering you, it's just there. But those malignant tumors they cause you problems, they might even kill you. These are the people that comprise, you know, twenty some percent of the US prison population. These are the people that nine times out of ten are involved in domestic violence situations. These are the dangerous ones. And certainly there are, as you said, levels in between, because it is on a spectrum. There are narcissistic qualities. We can list, you know, dozens of them. But just because you have some, and I want to be clear about this, does not mean you're a narcissist, because you know, here's another flip of the coin is people like me who have come from backgrounds where you are abused can tend to have narcissistic qualities.

15:18 But where I have learned to draw the line is what the intent is. If I am trying to control a situation, it is because it helps me, it feels safe because in the past, you know, I don't like surprises. I don't like the unexpected. I like to know and expective I can control something which I'm aware of, so I don't do as much anymore. But it's a matter of making myself feel safe, so I don't feel threatened and I don't feel like somebody is going to assault me. But a narcissist, their intent is to harm you. Their intent is to cause you pain or as you financial loss, or cause you, you know, mental torments. So I always say, if there is intentional harm involved, you are dealing with a malignant person. And you know, there are some people that don't even believe in narcissism, and that's fine. I always say, you know, a bad person's a bad person, and abuse is abuse.

16:19 If you're intentionally harming somebody, that's just morally wrong. It is morally corrupted, and there's a problem. Well, and you talk and I like the word you use, but you talk about the malignant narcissist, which is at that level. And as you say, and I had no idea, but twenty percent of those in prison are at that level. So you have that, but you also have those medium ones that still can cause great difficulty in relationships because they're so focused on themselves, and I smile. I have a lot of friends that love to do their selfies and post them and so forth, And you're right, you know it's cute, you can laugh about it and so forth, and it's not affecting anyone. And yet you get to you start to move up that bridge a bit, and all of a sudden you've got someone who is kind of wanting to make sure that it's done their way. They don't want to really allow you to do what you want to really want to be able to do. So there are those different levels, and at what point in time do we say, you know, what this is at a level that's going to be damaging to a relationship. Yeah, and you know that's a personal choice, unfortunately, because I even look at just you know, taking my former relationship, my former marriage. For example, my sister who I have by my biological father. She was raised by

17:52 our biological father. I was not. She would have never even spent one second with my ex husband because she was raised, you know, to have healthy self esteem and to set boundaries and to feel good and confident and assert herself in all these things. I was not raised that way. So it's a perspective. You know, what one person will tolerate and endure is different from the next. But I think anytime it is causing you, you know, like for me, I noticed in my childhood it was stomach aches and headaches, and now I just forget, you know, I feel like it's whodoo voodoo. But you know, I can feel somebody's energy. If somebody is just making me feel uneasy, whether you call that your gut feeling or whatever you want to call it, I just say, maybe they're not your person, and it's okay not to have a reason, you know, to justify that or substantiate that. It's okay. Not everybody is meant to get along, even if it's your family, because that's the problem with narcissism, it's it's everywhere. It can be family. I have no contact with my mother and stepfather. You know how much that hurts not have my mother in my life. But she doesn't want to do that. Her narcissist husband put a divide between us, and she told me she cannot be my mother and his wife all at the same time. Okay, I had a friend who was a narcissist. You know, the jealousy shows up. I had a coworker who was a narcissist, always stealing ideas, taking credit for work that I did, you know, stuff like that. So we see it all

19:26 around us. I mean even on the playground that you see the kids, there's always that dominant kid who's bullying everybody and who everybody's a little fearful of. That's a little narcissist. So you know, we can't avoid it. Well, then, and you bring up something very interesting, and I had thought about this jealousy. Jealousy in your mind? Is that an indication of narcissism to some degree? They think it's a very strong indication because when I look at the different narcissists and see patterns and just you know, I mean years of hearing everybody else's stories. One thing that's ironic is that some narcissists actually do have a very healthy self esteem. They think they actually do think they're superior to everybody else. But a lot of narcissists, ironically, they have none of that. They are very insecure, and they outwardly try to get that admiration in praise because they don't feel it inside themselves. So I think that that need to you know, do. Whatever it is they're doing to other people, that harm that they're causing is coming out of jealousy.

20:48 I know I've had it done to me, But it's usually that they're jealous that you have a certain personality type or quality about you that they wish they had, or maybe you have I don't know, some aspect of your life is envious to them, but there's something about you that just bothers their spirit, and so they just want to take you down. They want to make sure that you suffer in some way for the injustice that they feel that they weren't endowed with whatever it is that you have that they so desired. So it's it's strange how it works well. And you know, coming from a medical background, obviously, you know, I've always looked at what is the root cause of whatever. I was a dentist, but I used to focus on people who had had a neck pain, and so I would go in and really look, what's the root cause, what are the muscles, what's the neurological relationship here that's going on. So you look at narcissism. And I like the jealousy concept because if someone recognizes that they're jealous of someone for whatever reason, and they think that they're out making too many friends of the opposite sex, or or you know, they have a job that they don't have or whatever that is. How does a narcissist number one recognize what are some indications that they can consciously recognize is going on? And then how do they help themselves to become less narcissistic so that not only do they experience a

22:26 better life, that those around them experience a better life. Any thoughts on that, Oh, I have a lot of thoughts on that, but it comes down to one thought. A true narcissist, a true malignant narcissist, they have no self awareness, they have no remorse. They feel one hundred percent justified in treating people the way they do. That's where the problem lies. So you will never get them to the point they would never even consider the fact that there's some improvement they need to make to improve their lives. If anything, they will just blame it. And they're known to blame everybody else for whatever, you know, bad luck or you know, things that happen that don't go according to the way they wanted them to. Whatever it is that doesn't you know, happen for them, it's always somebody else's fault.

23:22 They don't have the ability, their ego cannot withstand that offense or the possibility that they might be less than in some way. I know I'm stuttering, but it's just it's hard for me to imagine being that type of a person that just honestly cannot see, you know, accountability in anything. But that's how these really true narcissists are because I always tell people people are so scared of being a narcissist, and I always say, well, if you're worried about being a narcissist, you're not a narcissist. Because a narcissist, a real one, is going to say, I'm not a narcissist, you're the narcissist. Well, and you're talking about the malignant narcissist. But I'm asking, I'm asking. You know, in relationships, oftentimes you see the different types of things. As you were saying, jealousy was the one that kind of hit me. But how does an individual recognize you know, they're going along and all of a sudden they recognize, Wow, I'm experiencing that emotion of jealousy to the point that it's probably not a healthy emotion to have.

24:33 How do they? So they're probably maybe what a quarter to a halfway up that ladder towards the malignancy. Oh, at least at that point, they're halfway there. Yeah, how do they? How do they overcome that? Because I believe everyone has the ability to some degree to be able to overcome some of those emotional challenges that are affecting not only themselves but others. So I think that if somebody is aware of their emotions and aware that they would like to, you know, they decide they want to improve something, I agree that they can overcome it. I however, do not believe a really malignant narcissist is going to forget of self awareness or accountability. But for those that over to middle section that do want to overcome it, I think it's like anything else, like any of us that want to improve some mental health situation, Just like you know, when I was trying to heal myself, you know, from triggers and panic attacks and all these awful things that come with a life of abuse. It's a matter of just knowing when that when that situation is striking, recognizing it, and you almost I always say it's like in your head. You have the crossroads where you can go this way or that way, and you ought to medically go that way, because every time you've been in this situation, you go that way. You tend

26:03 towards the jealousy, or you tend towards the control or whatever it is, and you have to learn to force yourself the other way until it gets you know, easy enough and where you're used to it enough where you automatically go that way. It's just like when you're regulating yourself, like I said, from a panic attack or any kind of anxiety that you know, one might feel. It's the same thing. Or even when I've been in those situations where I've had to stop myself and say, Okay, this is silly that I'm trying to control this situation so that i can feel safe, because usually whatever it is is very menial and meaningless in the scheme of life and in the scheme of the situation. To just step back and say, you know what, I'm going to be okay if this person does it that way, I'm going to be okay. You know, the jealous person might say, if you know this and have a vehicle of a certain brand, that I would like to have. Maybe I should work harder to get that. You know, of course you can overcome it. It's just a matter of rewiring your brain to think differently and to come at it from a different perspective instead of enving something or wishing something. Figure out what you you know, say it's okay for them to have it, for me to have this, for me to have what I want. This is what I need to do, and I can go about it a different way. Good. You know, you you talk about something that I that I want to share and ask you

27:37 about because you talk about, you know, knowing many brief experiences of people who have been able to release the shame that they carry within themselves and have the strength to remove themselves from that toxic relationship. So that's an interesting approach because what you're saying is that there is that sense of personal responsibility that they need to be able to release that shame that has allowed them to get into and stay within that abusive, narcissistic relationship. So talk a little bit about that. What are some of those experiences that you've observed with people that you've worked with and so forth on how how are they able to do that releasing shame. I again, I think it's a matter of perspective because you know, I know, for me, when I was starting my healing, I was carrying the shame. I thought I was the shameful thing because everybody had told me that I was. And you know, so it's a matter of turning it around and saying, wait a second. All these people who who did what they did to me or said what they said to me, whatever it is, it's because that there was something they weren't willing to face, some trauma, some terrible situation in their lives that they have not addressed yet.

29:04 It's their unhealed trauma. But instead of dealing with it, they put it on me. They burdened me with it. They kind of, you know, I kind of looked at it like I was the scapegoat for everybody else's shame that they had carried. But once I realized it wasn't about me, I could then work on improving myself in starting with myself talk. I am not going to talk to myself like other people talk to me. I deserve better than that, you know, realizing my worth that I was allowed to have love just like anyone else. You know, it just pains me when I hear I always hear these people, I'm unlovable, I'm broken, I'm damaged. It just that hurts my soul because nobody is broken and unlovable.

29:52 Some might be harder to love than others. I mean, granted, like a narcissist who is malignant, but there's so people out there that will love that person. And I mean that's what mothers are for, right, So you know, I think it's just a matter of really, I mean, you have to be very self aware. You have to want to go on that journey with yourself to find out where where it hits you hard and where that where that stuff lies. I always say, it's kind of like digging up a rose bush. You know, on the surface, you think, oh, the rose bush is, you know, prickling me with thorn. It's the rose bush's fault. It's my ex husband that abused me and my stepfather abused me. Well guess what, I can cut that thing off and then it's not prickling me with its thorns. But if I want to dig it up out of the ground and really get to it, I'm digging and I'm digging, and boy, every time I think I got to the bottom, there's more. It keeps going down, all the way down to its roots. And anyone who's ever dug up a rose bush understands what I'm talking about. It's for let listen and listen awful, and that's what healing looks like. But if you're willing to do the work, you know, you will find out things about yourself that will give you that information and that depth that you need to know where you gotta you know, I always say it's like having two wires up here. Like I said that crossroads, Like I always go down this road, I want to go down a different road.

31:18 I want to try that one and see if that works better. Because nobody wants to feel, you know, any of the negative feelings they feel, or have any of the negative reactions they have to to people in life. And you know, we don't want to sweat and get panicky and have our heart racing and that's no fun. And I don't really believe that any good human being wants to really hurt other human beings. So, you know, if we can be better, I think people forget that your mental health, you know, is what feeds into your life every day, into every word that comes out of your mouth, into every action you do. And you know, we're so consumed do with physical health. You know, oh, you want to lose weight, you want to get muscles, you're lifting weights, you're running, you're walking. But what do we do for our mental health. It's like we ignore it and just think, oh, well, you know somebody else's fault. I'm not going to deal with it, or I'll drink some beers and swallow my product. You know, it doesn't work that way. You have to actually be very aware and invested in your mental health and work it out daily, whether it's through meditation or whether it's through some sort of therapy or journaling or whatever it is that you do.

32:32 You know, to get in touch with yourself and to know how you feel and know why you feel that way and how you can be better. That's where your change comes. That's where learning, growth and change come. Well, and I think you've said something really important and it goes to perception. This concept of perception. You know, it's interesting. You know I've used this examply for so here's five people at an intersection and then there's an accident, and if you ask each individual what happened, You're going to get a different story because they have their perception based on whatever that happens to be. So, as a child, your perception is is when someone says you're no good or blah blah blah, your perception is is that's true and what you said, I think is so important recognizing that when when someone communicates to you, they are literally communicating from their own emotions. It has nothing to do with you. It has everything to do with them. I've told people that I've worked with before that you know what is if you want to see the cause of your challenge, lift that mirror and look at yourself in the mirror rather than looking at the other person. But then the other thing the other way around. Turn that mirror around. When someone is saying unkind things to you, being abusive, being bullying, whatever that happens to be, turn the marror around and recognize that it's their problem, it's not your problem.

34:06 And I think that's such an important concept to understand. Yeah, I agree. I mean that was the beginning of my healing when I really literally made that. You don't put that together. It was just realizing that what I thought was causing me so much mental angst and thereby physical. It wasn't even mine, it was everyone else's. And when I realized that, I was like, Okay, well I can deal with my stuff, you know, because now that I've set down everybody else's, you know, shame that they've burdened me with caring. Now I can just carry my own and it's much lighter. And if you can go through life being a good person, doing the right thing, you know, doing your best at every opportunity, I think your conscience is much lighter as well, and so it's much easier to go through life that way way. But it also involves, you know, definitely. I'm a big believer in setting boundaries and being assertive. We don't have to be unkind to do those things, but I think it's essential for people to know that this is where my boundaries are. You're welcome to do anything within those boundaries. But you know, if you're not willing to participate, if you're not willing to play this game, then you're not my person.

35:24 Maybe, and I wish you well, and that's fine. You know, Like I said, we are not all meant to get along. And I think that, you know, I spent most of my life trying so hard to be what everybody else wanted to be, me to be, but I couldn't be everything. I could only be me. And that's when my life started to change. Is when I realized that at forty four years old, yeah, time to discover your own true voice, which I think is so important. So talk a little bit more about your book. How do people find your book? And and this really is about you, So what value do people get out of reading your book? Do you think the value is is that I don't hold back. I didn't hold back a single thing.

36:10 It is very raw. It is every thought that was in my head at every moment that you know, caused me some kind of you know, mental or physical impression in my life with my ex husband, it's definitely a very accurate portrayal of a relationship with a narcissist as well. But like I said, it's just a journey from being that hopeless, devastated. I mean, at some points I didn't even want to live anymore to finding out that I had had the power all along inside me to love myself. I didn't need his love, I needed my love. I needed to respect myself.

36:58 I had the power to remove myself from situations like that marriage that were causing me so much stress and distress that it was making me ill. And it's a beautiful thing that, you know. Part of this journey was, you know, asking myself what I wanted because I had relied on what everybody else was dictating to me my whole life. And narcissists they do control every aspect of your life. So it's a rough journey. But and it's a rough read for some. I have only had one person say they couldn't finish it because it was too triggering, But it's because I thought it was so important to just give the full experience. This is not superficial by any means.

37:45 If anything, I feel like it gives voice to the people who have been in those situations or still are that don't even know or understand how they feel or why they feel it. So I encourage everyone to check it out. It's called Gasping for Air, The Stranglehold of Narcissistic Abuse. It is available anywhere books are sold online. You can go to my website and click on the link, or you can go straight to most people go to Amazon, and I will say it is also available on ebook because I know people that are in abusive situations do not need a book on their coffee table that has the word abuse on it. So you can get it for free if you're a Kindle number, or just get it on whatever reading device you have because it is available in that format well. And I think the key to this is that you not only explain what you experienced, but you explain the journey of how you finally got yourself out of it. And I think that for many people being able to read that gives them a sense of hope and understanding that yes, they can do it too. So as we close, what I'd like for you to do is just share with the and I know you probably are going to repeat something that you've said, but share with the audience the message from your heart that you'd like them to understand. I have a lot of things I like to share from my heart, but certainly one of

39:16 the biggest messages I want people to know is that you were not meant to suffer here. I spent my whole life thinking that maybe that was what I was meant to be here for. It's not. And I do absolutely touching upon what we just spoke about. I do absolutely want people to see me as an example of somebody who has overcome circumstances, who has released who is by the power in myself and my love and respect for myself, released myself from circumstances that were very distressing to my mental and physical health. I deserved better. I didn't know I did until I decided I did. But when you decide you want more, when you decide that you're worth more, you can have it. Because I'm going to tell you, in just three and a half short years since my divorce, I have gone from scrubbing toilets and floors cleaning houses in a podunk town. So now I'm a published author.

40:16 I have two more books coming out. I have been on podcasts all over the world and spoken in summits for healing and doing everything I wanted to do since I was, you know, a teenage girl. I wanted to be a writer. I wanted to travel. I wanted to help other victims of abuse, and I'm able to do that now. So I hope that other people will find what's true in their heart. Ask yourself what you want, See that vision, see that passion, see your goals. Because I promise you, once you see those things, you won't be able to unsee them, and you will start enacting the steps towards achieving them. Wonderful, well said. Thank you so much for Dana, Thank you for being vulnerable, and thank you for being transparent to the point that you were willing to write that book because I guarantee you, and I'm sure you already know this, that it's going to help numerous people who will read that book. So I really appreciate you being on the show. I acknowledge all the good that you're doing and hope that we'll get you back on the show again soon. Wonderful.

41:22 Thanks for having me your betting folks, Thanks for listening. Hope you enjoyed it, and please reach out because you're going to. I think for those that are experiencing this type of situation, it can make a difference for you. So have a great week. This is doctor Doug saying I'm mistake