April 14, 2026

Be the You That’s More You: Healing, Identity & New Beginnings

Be the You That’s More You: Healing, Identity & New Beginnings
iHeartRadio podcast player iconSpotify podcast player iconAmazon Music podcast player iconAudible podcast player iconPandora podcast player iconApple Podcasts podcast player iconSpreaker podcast player iconPodchaser podcast player iconAudacy podcast player iconDeezer podcast player iconTuneIn podcast player iconRSS Feed podcast player iconPodcast Addict podcast player iconCastro podcast player iconCastamatic podcast player iconCastbox podcast player iconFountain podcast player iconJioSaavn podcast player iconPlayerFM podcast player iconOvercast podcast player iconGoodpods podcast player iconPocketCasts podcast player iconPodverse podcast player iconPodurama podcast player iconPodimo podcast player iconPodyssey podcast player iconYouTube podcast player iconYoutube Music podcast player icon
iHeartRadio podcast player iconSpotify podcast player iconAmazon Music podcast player iconAudible podcast player iconPandora podcast player iconApple Podcasts podcast player iconSpreaker podcast player iconPodchaser podcast player iconAudacy podcast player iconDeezer podcast player iconTuneIn podcast player iconRSS Feed podcast player iconPodcast Addict podcast player iconCastro podcast player iconCastamatic podcast player iconCastbox podcast player iconFountain podcast player iconJioSaavn podcast player iconPlayerFM podcast player iconOvercast podcast player iconGoodpods podcast player iconPocketCasts podcast player iconPodverse podcast player iconPodurama podcast player iconPodimo podcast player iconPodyssey podcast player iconYouTube podcast player iconYoutube Music podcast player icon

Kristen Crabtree shares how leaving a psychologically abusive marriage, doing deep trauma work, and returning to a book she wrote in 1999 led her to reclaim her identity, reconnect with the divine within, and guide others through divorce, life transitions, and powerful new beginnings.Www.paramourparadox.com

Inspire Vision Podcast is broadcast on K4HD Radio (www.k4hd.com) part of Talk 4 Radio (www.talk4radio.com) on the Talk 4 Media Network (www.talk4media.com). Inspire Vision Podcast TV Show is viewed on Talk 4 TV (www.talk4tv.com).

Inspire Vision Podcast is also available on Talk 4 Podcasting (www.talk4podcasting.com), iHeartRadio, Amazon Music, Pandora, Spotify, Audible, and over 100 other podcast outlets.

WEBVTT

1
00:00:01.000 --> 00:00:04.599
This program is designed to provide general information with regards

2
00:00:04.639 --> 00:00:07.599
to the subject matters covered. This information is given with

3
00:00:07.639 --> 00:00:12.000
the understanding that neither the hosts, guests, sponsors, or station

4
00:00:12.240 --> 00:00:17.399
are engaged in rendering any specific and personal medical, financial,

5
00:00:17.800 --> 00:00:22.719
legal counseling, professional service, or any advice. You should seek

6
00:00:22.760 --> 00:00:26.839
the services of competent professionals before applying or trying any

7
00:00:26.960 --> 00:00:29.600
suggested ideas.

8
00:00:31.039 --> 00:00:33.000
At the end of the day, it's not about what

9
00:00:33.039 --> 00:00:36.320
you have or even what you've accomplished. It's about what

10
00:00:36.359 --> 00:00:39.920
you've done with those accomplishments. It's about who you've lifted up,

11
00:00:40.240 --> 00:00:43.520
who you've made better. It's about what you've given back.

12
00:00:44.079 --> 00:00:48.560
Denzel Washington, welcome to inspire Vision. Our sole purpose is

13
00:00:48.600 --> 00:00:51.280
to elevate the lives of others and to inspire you

14
00:00:51.359 --> 00:00:52.000
to do the same.

15
00:00:52.600 --> 00:00:56.640
Kristen, Welcome, Hi doctor, How are you doing good?

16
00:00:56.679 --> 00:00:59.240
Hey, I'm excited to have you here. I think that

17
00:01:00.159 --> 00:01:02.679
your story is going to be very fascinating for people.

18
00:01:02.719 --> 00:01:06.079
And you know, like I always like, I always say,

19
00:01:06.239 --> 00:01:11.719
it's so interesting to hear someone's story and see how

20
00:01:11.760 --> 00:01:16.799
they have taken that story and become someone who is

21
00:01:16.879 --> 00:01:20.920
making a difference for others. And so what I'd love

22
00:01:20.959 --> 00:01:23.480
for you to do, is sure your story, go back

23
00:01:23.519 --> 00:01:25.719
as far as you need to, and kind of share

24
00:01:25.760 --> 00:01:29.319
your story about what brought you to this point of

25
00:01:29.439 --> 00:01:30.359
doing what you're doing.

26
00:01:31.560 --> 00:01:34.799
Yes, I would love to do that. So most recently,

27
00:01:35.040 --> 00:01:37.719
I just published a book called Be the You That's

28
00:01:37.760 --> 00:01:40.760
more You than You've ever been. And if you want

29
00:01:40.840 --> 00:01:44.280
me to circle back to the origins of that book,

30
00:01:44.680 --> 00:01:49.120
we actually have to backtrack to nineteen ninety nine. I

31
00:01:49.120 --> 00:01:53.799
wrote the book back then and subsequently got into a

32
00:01:55.079 --> 00:02:01.239
marriage that was psychologically abusive. And when you're in that

33
00:02:01.359 --> 00:02:04.040
kind of manipulation and control, you don't realize it's happening

34
00:02:04.120 --> 00:02:11.719
until you're basically nothing. So I did miraculously get out

35
00:02:11.800 --> 00:02:15.400
before I was completely gone, and it took a while

36
00:02:15.439 --> 00:02:19.039
to settle my nervous system down once I did, and

37
00:02:19.120 --> 00:02:24.240
I did that ultimately through meditation. Now meditation takes a

38
00:02:24.240 --> 00:02:26.360
lot of forms, but that's what that's what I did,

39
00:02:26.919 --> 00:02:31.400
and I started to hear, I started to connect again

40
00:02:31.479 --> 00:02:34.479
with my truth, my true self, whatever you want to

41
00:02:34.520 --> 00:02:38.639
call it. My true self told me to go find

42
00:02:38.639 --> 00:02:41.159
the book I wrote in nineteen ninety nine. I barely

43
00:02:41.199 --> 00:02:44.719
remembered I wrote it, but I'm a digital hoarder, and

44
00:02:44.960 --> 00:02:48.319
I had it digitally, so I dug it out and

45
00:02:48.520 --> 00:02:53.039
the book started with the first chapter was eight exercises,

46
00:02:54.080 --> 00:02:56.879
And as I went through the exercises, I realized that

47
00:02:57.680 --> 00:03:00.439
what they were designed to do was to and cover

48
00:03:01.039 --> 00:03:04.879
your truth, uncover connect you back to your inner voice

49
00:03:04.919 --> 00:03:09.680
that is all knowing. And I thought to myself, who

50
00:03:09.759 --> 00:03:16.479
wrote these exercises? They're brilliant, But I also use them

51
00:03:16.840 --> 00:03:20.599
to find my way back to myself. In the process

52
00:03:20.599 --> 00:03:25.479
of doing that, through going through the book that I

53
00:03:25.520 --> 00:03:30.280
originally wrote then and have now largely rewritten, but kept

54
00:03:30.280 --> 00:03:35.919
the same sort of structure goal. So through that process,

55
00:03:36.520 --> 00:03:44.400
compounded by meditation and journaling, I was advised my true self,

56
00:03:45.199 --> 00:03:49.719
as weird as that may sound, to create something called

57
00:03:50.280 --> 00:03:55.840
the Paara More Paradox ecosystem. And the basis of that

58
00:03:55.960 --> 00:03:58.639
ecosystem is the book be the you that's more you

59
00:03:58.759 --> 00:03:59.520
than you've ever been.

60
00:04:00.479 --> 00:04:05.000
Wonderful now, you know, And it's interesting what I find interesting,

61
00:04:05.120 --> 00:04:08.319
And I happen to come from a theological background, so

62
00:04:08.800 --> 00:04:11.759
forgive me if I go somewhere you don't want to go.

63
00:04:12.159 --> 00:04:16.199
But what's fascinating to me is this concept.

64
00:04:15.719 --> 00:04:21.560
Of the me and all of a sudden, this inspiration

65
00:04:21.959 --> 00:04:25.680
or whatever you want to call it that actually comes

66
00:04:25.720 --> 00:04:29.079
to us, and I think it's fascinating to know that

67
00:04:29.199 --> 00:04:32.680
it's there, it's real, it isn't something that's just made up.

68
00:04:32.720 --> 00:04:36.639
That it's true inspiration that is available to you. And

69
00:04:36.680 --> 00:04:40.199
as you say, meditation makes a huge difference with that

70
00:04:40.399 --> 00:04:44.360
because as you meditate it, it takes you away from

71
00:04:44.399 --> 00:04:47.120
all that other external stuff and allows you to kind

72
00:04:47.120 --> 00:04:50.439
of tap into that. And I think it's important for

73
00:04:50.480 --> 00:04:53.519
people to understand that you know what it's there, and

74
00:04:53.560 --> 00:04:56.360
it's there for you, and that's important.

75
00:04:56.439 --> 00:05:01.439
So let's talk a little bit about what I find

76
00:05:01.439 --> 00:05:02.120
it interesting.

77
00:05:02.399 --> 00:05:05.759
As I've interviewed numbers of people and even considered this myself.

78
00:05:05.800 --> 00:05:09.279
I got I've got four kids, okay, And you know,

79
00:05:09.319 --> 00:05:13.279
as we talk about parenting, I always wonder, and I

80
00:05:13.319 --> 00:05:15.319
do have discussion with my kids about this, but I

81
00:05:15.360 --> 00:05:18.600
always wonder what things did I do as a parent

82
00:05:18.720 --> 00:05:22.000
that I wasn't even aware of that might have had

83
00:05:22.199 --> 00:05:26.439
an effect on them and their perception to the point

84
00:05:26.480 --> 00:05:29.360
that it might not have been a positive experience for them.

85
00:05:29.600 --> 00:05:31.600
And we've discovered there are a few of those things.

86
00:05:31.959 --> 00:05:34.920
But when you talk about psychological abuse.

87
00:05:35.480 --> 00:05:38.360
And I think for a number of people that are listening,

88
00:05:38.480 --> 00:05:41.560
both women and men, because men go through the same thing,

89
00:05:42.199 --> 00:05:45.600
explain what were some of the things that were going

90
00:05:45.759 --> 00:05:51.079
on that number one, really were causing that psychological abuse

91
00:05:51.240 --> 00:05:54.839
and number two, why you didn't pick up on that's

92
00:05:54.879 --> 00:05:55.839
what was going on.

93
00:05:57.040 --> 00:05:59.800
That It brings out a deep breath in me because

94
00:06:00.959 --> 00:06:06.319
you know, when I tell you that the abuse, anybody

95
00:06:06.399 --> 00:06:09.680
who hasn't gone through it, and even some people who

96
00:06:09.720 --> 00:06:12.519
are in the midst of it, it doesn't sound like abuse, right.

97
00:06:13.079 --> 00:06:17.279
It's not the getting socked in the face. It doesn't

98
00:06:17.399 --> 00:06:20.680
leave you know, scars and bruises and cuts and swollen

99
00:06:21.160 --> 00:06:24.560
you know, parts of your body. And that is all.

100
00:06:24.639 --> 00:06:27.519
I am definitely not downplaying that. I mean, it's awful,

101
00:06:27.680 --> 00:06:32.560
it's it's terrible. That being said, it is something you

102
00:06:32.600 --> 00:06:37.959
can see, right, psychological abuse is so subtle that and

103
00:06:38.360 --> 00:06:43.040
it's designed for you not to see it happening. So examples,

104
00:06:43.319 --> 00:06:46.879
and you know, the thing is, it's not it's not

105
00:06:47.120 --> 00:06:49.160
any one thing. The things that I tell you are

106
00:06:49.199 --> 00:06:53.600
going to be seem so like stupid really, but it's

107
00:06:53.639 --> 00:06:57.480
the constant every second of the day, every second of

108
00:06:57.519 --> 00:07:00.839
the day, these things happening that whittle away at you

109
00:07:01.040 --> 00:07:04.879
so that you just don't exist anymore. So it's things

110
00:07:05.000 --> 00:07:09.920
like waking up, bringing a cup of coffee, being told

111
00:07:10.560 --> 00:07:12.839
that the coffee is not right or that it could

112
00:07:12.839 --> 00:07:17.680
be better. Don't talk until she's had her cup of coffee.

113
00:07:18.720 --> 00:07:21.600
Once she's had her cup of coffee, I'm allowed to talk,

114
00:07:21.639 --> 00:07:23.800
but I have to stop talking at five because that's

115
00:07:23.800 --> 00:07:26.879
when the TV comes on and the drinking starts. And

116
00:07:26.959 --> 00:07:29.439
we both were guilty of drinking. So it's not not

117
00:07:29.519 --> 00:07:33.800
just her. It's the Let me teach you how to

118
00:07:34.720 --> 00:07:37.319
clean a cutting board because you don't do it right.

119
00:07:37.399 --> 00:07:40.360
Let me teach you how to choose an avocado and

120
00:07:40.399 --> 00:07:44.879
then cut the avocado and then serve the avocado. Let

121
00:07:44.920 --> 00:07:51.240
me teach you how to what detergent to buy, which changed.

122
00:07:51.720 --> 00:07:56.360
When she's depressed, I have to purchase the cheapest products,

123
00:07:56.839 --> 00:08:00.079
and when she's in a different state, I have to

124
00:08:00.079 --> 00:08:03.560
to do organic, and you know know, so I could

125
00:08:03.639 --> 00:08:08.040
never get it right. You know, it's I mean, the

126
00:08:08.079 --> 00:08:11.000
list goes on, but it's all these little trivial I

127
00:08:11.079 --> 00:08:16.399
used to take pictures of products in the grocery store

128
00:08:16.959 --> 00:08:19.240
and text them to her and say, you know, which

129
00:08:19.279 --> 00:08:21.560
brand do you want in which flavor? Because if I

130
00:08:21.600 --> 00:08:25.120
got it wrong, it wasn't a yell, it wasn't a punch,

131
00:08:25.199 --> 00:08:29.519
It was a deep sign eye roll. And maybe you

132
00:08:29.560 --> 00:08:32.000
know you waste so much of our money by getting

133
00:08:32.000 --> 00:08:35.720
the wrong thing, that kind of thing constant.

134
00:08:36.200 --> 00:08:39.559
How far this is what fascinates me. And believe me,

135
00:08:39.600 --> 00:08:43.440
we have all experiences me too. How far did you

136
00:08:43.559 --> 00:08:47.960
get into that relationship before you started noticing things? Or

137
00:08:48.120 --> 00:08:50.200
was this from the very get going? You just did

138
00:08:50.240 --> 00:08:51.759
not pick up on the red flags?

139
00:08:52.360 --> 00:08:55.279
So upon reflection, it was from the get go, but

140
00:08:55.320 --> 00:08:59.480
it did amplify as time went on. But the reason

141
00:08:59.840 --> 00:09:01.639
I I think I didn't see it. I actually just

142
00:09:01.720 --> 00:09:05.879
had this revelation a couple of weeks ago that she

143
00:09:06.200 --> 00:09:10.200
used my prior trauma against me. So I had been

144
00:09:10.799 --> 00:09:14.399
sexually assaulted and raped when I was young, and I

145
00:09:14.519 --> 00:09:18.399
had a lot of fear around safety, my physical safety,

146
00:09:19.000 --> 00:09:23.759
and she was a police officer, and so she created

147
00:09:24.320 --> 00:09:29.720
a life where I believed in order to be safe,

148
00:09:30.120 --> 00:09:34.200
I had to be kept safe by her, and so

149
00:09:34.320 --> 00:09:40.080
in effect she turned my abuse into the control mechanism.

150
00:09:41.080 --> 00:09:45.120
When I was fifty three, so four years ago, I

151
00:09:45.240 --> 00:09:51.159
underwent intensive trauma therapy. A lot of people have heard

152
00:09:51.159 --> 00:09:54.559
of EMDR. This was done by an EMDR therapist, but

153
00:09:54.600 --> 00:09:57.679
it's something called progressive counting, but it's the same sort

154
00:09:57.720 --> 00:10:00.000
of thing. It was eight hours a day for six days,

155
00:10:00.679 --> 00:10:04.600
and when I left his office, he said to me, now,

156
00:10:04.759 --> 00:10:07.639
for the next two years, things are going to change,

157
00:10:08.240 --> 00:10:12.639
because you've just set down a huge load. And quite frankly,

158
00:10:13.240 --> 00:10:18.320
those words scared me because I didn't want things to change.

159
00:10:18.399 --> 00:10:22.679
I mean, change is scary, right, And I also didn't

160
00:10:22.720 --> 00:10:25.360
think I had a bad marriage because we never fought.

161
00:10:25.720 --> 00:10:28.639
But what I didn't realize was we never fought because

162
00:10:28.639 --> 00:10:33.960
I was trained to never disagree right. And so over

163
00:10:34.000 --> 00:10:38.320
the next two years things did change, and I would

164
00:10:38.320 --> 00:10:42.480
have these moments of realizing that it wasn't right, but

165
00:10:42.600 --> 00:10:46.440
whenever I did, we actually would have all little conflicts

166
00:10:46.559 --> 00:10:49.480
because all of a sudden I wasn't behaving, I wasn't

167
00:10:49.519 --> 00:10:55.320
staying in line. So it started early on, it got

168
00:10:55.360 --> 00:10:59.840
intensified as time went, and certainly once she started to

169
00:11:00.200 --> 00:11:04.440
sense that the grip she had on me wasn't as solid,

170
00:11:05.519 --> 00:11:09.840
the control efforts escalated. But in a way that's good,

171
00:11:09.879 --> 00:11:12.120
because it escalated to a point where I could actually

172
00:11:12.360 --> 00:11:14.960
see it. You know, my dad calls it the frog

173
00:11:15.000 --> 00:11:16.600
in the pot, which I'm sure a lot of you

174
00:11:16.639 --> 00:11:20.039
have heard of. You know, you put a frog and

175
00:11:20.080 --> 00:11:22.519
boiling water, it hops out. You put a frog and

176
00:11:22.600 --> 00:11:26.840
water and gently increase the temperature, it boils to death,

177
00:11:26.960 --> 00:11:28.720
you know. And that's what my dad called me. It

178
00:11:28.759 --> 00:11:29.639
was the frog in the pot.

179
00:11:30.000 --> 00:11:30.279
Wow.

180
00:11:30.399 --> 00:11:33.360
And so at this point in time, what are you doing?

181
00:11:33.440 --> 00:11:38.039
What are you doing? Are you retired? Are you coaching people?

182
00:11:38.080 --> 00:11:39.159
Are you helping people?

183
00:11:39.200 --> 00:11:42.039
What? What are you doing other than bringing forth that

184
00:11:42.120 --> 00:11:45.000
book which will be published one where you broadcast this?

185
00:11:45.679 --> 00:11:49.679
Yeah? So the book is the foundation of there's sort

186
00:11:49.720 --> 00:11:54.200
of two things I'm doing. There's my big passion project,

187
00:11:54.240 --> 00:11:58.080
which is the umbrella under which everything else is housed.

188
00:12:00.600 --> 00:12:04.080
A pair more paradox. Ecosystem is made up of a book,

189
00:12:04.559 --> 00:12:09.440
a journal, an app, T shirts which sound like they

190
00:12:09.440 --> 00:12:11.759
don't belong, but they do if you look at what

191
00:12:11.879 --> 00:12:17.039
they are, a course which is still under development in

192
00:12:17.080 --> 00:12:20.639
a community. And did I mention the app? I think

193
00:12:20.679 --> 00:12:26.600
I did. That's not really my money maker, so to speak.

194
00:12:27.200 --> 00:12:29.519
And I have no idea if it ever will be.

195
00:12:29.679 --> 00:12:32.399
It exists because I was told to do it. And

196
00:12:32.559 --> 00:12:37.840
I think it will help people. The more career part

197
00:12:38.000 --> 00:12:41.559
of what I do is I'm a certified divorce coach

198
00:12:42.240 --> 00:12:48.039
and while I work with all populations, straight men, straight women, whatever,

199
00:12:48.320 --> 00:12:52.960
my specialty, my niche that I really want to speak

200
00:12:53.000 --> 00:12:57.519
to is lesbian women in psychologically abusive marriages. There are

201
00:12:57.519 --> 00:13:02.600
some special nuances to worse when you're in a gay relationship.

202
00:13:02.840 --> 00:13:04.919
I happen to be a lesbian, so it's easier for

203
00:13:05.000 --> 00:13:09.399
me to you know, zero in on that. And there

204
00:13:09.440 --> 00:13:14.960
are certainly special nuances that happen in psychologically abusive divorces,

205
00:13:16.120 --> 00:13:21.639
and so I have decided to target that group specifically

206
00:13:22.440 --> 00:13:26.399
because I think I can bring a lot of special experience.

207
00:13:27.639 --> 00:13:30.840
But I do work with you know, other people as well.

208
00:13:30.960 --> 00:13:31.759
Okay, so, and.

209
00:13:32.039 --> 00:13:34.799
You bring up an interesting point because what you're talking

210
00:13:34.799 --> 00:13:39.559
about is applicable to straight marriages, whatever, but you're focusing

211
00:13:39.799 --> 00:13:44.879
on that lesbian situation and you talk about special nuances.

212
00:13:45.440 --> 00:13:48.480
And for those that are listening that may be experiencing

213
00:13:48.519 --> 00:13:52.080
this and fit into that category, what are the nuances

214
00:13:52.720 --> 00:13:58.159
or someone who is lesbian that is experiencing that.

215
00:13:58.840 --> 00:14:02.159
Yes, And I I just realized that is a super

216
00:14:02.200 --> 00:14:04.759
important question that I'm going to answer in plenty of detail,

217
00:14:05.000 --> 00:14:09.360
but I just realized I didn't clarify a pair. More paradox,

218
00:14:09.600 --> 00:14:14.879
the full ecosystem is not gay specific. It's not divorced specific.

219
00:14:15.080 --> 00:14:18.480
It's about anybody facing that existential question of who am I?

220
00:14:19.000 --> 00:14:24.639
So people retiring, empty nesters, you know whatever. So let

221
00:14:24.639 --> 00:14:27.399
me put that to the side down to address your questions.

222
00:14:27.480 --> 00:14:33.960
So with lesbian relationships, whether they are psychologically abusive or

223
00:14:34.039 --> 00:14:41.240
perfectly healthy, we weren't allowed to marry until relatively recently.

224
00:14:41.480 --> 00:14:45.039
So for example, I've been married for twenty two years,

225
00:14:45.080 --> 00:14:48.320
but the first part of that wasn't legal marriage. We

226
00:14:48.399 --> 00:14:51.720
did wind up getting legally married, but it wasn't legal.

227
00:14:52.120 --> 00:14:58.399
A lot of women I know lesbian couples don't bother,

228
00:14:58.879 --> 00:15:02.840
didn't bother getting married formally because they'd already been in

229
00:15:02.879 --> 00:15:05.919
their marriage for ten fifteen years, Like why do we

230
00:15:05.960 --> 00:15:10.080
need the piece of paper? So, in either situation, whether

231
00:15:10.159 --> 00:15:16.639
it's a committed relationship that was never sanctioned by the

232
00:15:16.639 --> 00:15:22.480
government or whether it actually was a formal marriage, some

233
00:15:22.519 --> 00:15:30.159
of the nuances that crop up are around the asset division.

234
00:15:31.320 --> 00:15:35.399
If you aren't legally married, you know, do you really

235
00:15:35.480 --> 00:15:41.519
get the proper distribution of assets if you have a child.

236
00:15:42.399 --> 00:15:47.759
In some places, and sometimes that could be a pretty

237
00:15:47.840 --> 00:15:55.559
serious challenge, the birth mother would definitely be seen as

238
00:15:55.720 --> 00:15:59.840
the mother, and the question is whether the other partner

239
00:16:00.480 --> 00:16:04.279
is or not. In some cases yes, in some cases no.

240
00:16:04.919 --> 00:16:10.320
You compound that with the psychologically abusive component, and this

241
00:16:10.440 --> 00:16:13.960
part pertains to straight men straight women, and you are

242
00:16:14.000 --> 00:16:19.919
absolutely correct that straight men fay psychological abuse. And that's

243
00:16:19.960 --> 00:16:22.720
actually one of the other things is I think a

244
00:16:22.759 --> 00:16:27.200
lot of people think women can't be the abusers, and

245
00:16:27.240 --> 00:16:30.759
they certainly think women aren't going to abuse other women, right,

246
00:16:31.360 --> 00:16:38.639
And so that psychological abuse combined with the female female

247
00:16:38.720 --> 00:16:44.080
relationship is even more complicated because people in their community,

248
00:16:44.639 --> 00:16:49.480
people in their family and friends, they don't necessarily see

249
00:16:49.519 --> 00:16:54.200
that that can happen. And then again with the psychological

250
00:16:54.200 --> 00:16:57.919
abuse component, the manipulation and control that was in the

251
00:16:57.960 --> 00:17:04.240
marriage doesn't stop, you know, with the divorce that often amplifies,

252
00:17:05.480 --> 00:17:07.359
and it takes a lot of different shapes in a

253
00:17:07.359 --> 00:17:12.160
lot of different forms. And so many people are saying, oh,

254
00:17:12.279 --> 00:17:15.480
my spouse is a narcissist or my ex is a narcissist.

255
00:17:15.839 --> 00:17:19.960
That now it's being dismissed, and in some cases they

256
00:17:20.000 --> 00:17:22.799
really are a narcissist, like in some cases, we all

257
00:17:22.839 --> 00:17:27.279
have some narcissistic behavior. We all do. And again, during

258
00:17:27.279 --> 00:17:29.839
a divorce, you're not so great traits tend to be

259
00:17:29.880 --> 00:17:35.680
the ones that come out. And so I think sometimes

260
00:17:36.200 --> 00:17:40.960
the victim, the person that is enduring the abuse, will

261
00:17:41.079 --> 00:17:48.279
get discounted by saying they've been psychologically abused, because that's

262
00:17:48.359 --> 00:17:49.640
kind of the thing that you say.

263
00:17:50.079 --> 00:17:54.079
Yeah, and there's sometimes no other explanation. And as you say,

264
00:17:54.119 --> 00:17:56.920
a lot of times you don't even know what's going

265
00:17:56.960 --> 00:18:02.119
on until finally something happened that you go, oh my goodness,

266
00:18:02.480 --> 00:18:05.519
I just I just had no idea. So and again

267
00:18:05.559 --> 00:18:08.319
as we get now and even more into the discussion

268
00:18:08.519 --> 00:18:12.839
about you know, and we're talking straight relationships, we're talking

269
00:18:13.400 --> 00:18:15.000
gay relationships, both.

270
00:18:14.799 --> 00:18:15.519
Men and women.

271
00:18:16.160 --> 00:18:19.440
And with your paramount with the other thing that you

272
00:18:19.480 --> 00:18:22.279
talk about, you brought up some interesting things. You've got

273
00:18:22.319 --> 00:18:25.480
the people who all all their kids have left, and

274
00:18:25.599 --> 00:18:29.319
so we're talking about change, we're talking I remember listening

275
00:18:29.400 --> 00:18:34.279
to a presentation the other day, and the presentation was

276
00:18:34.319 --> 00:18:37.519
about new beginnings and realizing that, you.

277
00:18:37.400 --> 00:18:40.359
Know what, you can always have new beginnings.

278
00:18:40.880 --> 00:18:44.759
And I found it fascinating that we don't realize the

279
00:18:44.839 --> 00:18:49.559
emotional challenges that occur when change takes place in our

280
00:18:49.599 --> 00:18:52.799
life and we're in what we might refer to as

281
00:18:52.839 --> 00:18:56.000
a new beginning, whether we have chosen to do that

282
00:18:56.279 --> 00:18:58.200
or whether it's a result of something else.

283
00:18:58.519 --> 00:19:02.440
Yes, so how does how does someone? How does someone

284
00:19:02.559 --> 00:19:03.640
start to deal with that?

285
00:19:04.160 --> 00:19:07.000
With which part just the change? Just that?

286
00:19:07.119 --> 00:19:07.400
Yeah?

287
00:19:08.119 --> 00:19:13.359
So, and again the the book is I didn't I

288
00:19:13.400 --> 00:19:17.759
didn't start looking at the divorce coaching until after the

289
00:19:17.799 --> 00:19:21.160
book was you know, written and off to get printed.

290
00:19:21.519 --> 00:19:25.559
Really well sort of anyways, separate things. The book has

291
00:19:25.599 --> 00:19:29.079
nothing to do with divorce or any of that. What

292
00:19:29.160 --> 00:19:31.880
it does have to do with, and what it's designed

293
00:19:31.920 --> 00:19:35.000
to do, is answer that existential question of who am I?

294
00:19:35.440 --> 00:19:39.440
People going through divorce tend to ask themselves who am I?

295
00:19:40.319 --> 00:19:45.240
People leaving a psychologically abusive marriage definitely are asking who

296
00:19:45.279 --> 00:19:48.319
am I? But as we just you know, touched on

297
00:19:49.039 --> 00:19:54.720
empty nesters, people facing retirement, even some of the like

298
00:19:54.839 --> 00:20:00.640
thirty year olds who graduated from college, you know, eight

299
00:20:00.759 --> 00:20:04.240
years ago, they got their first job and they've been

300
00:20:04.279 --> 00:20:07.640
at it for five, six, seven years, and they're looking

301
00:20:07.720 --> 00:20:10.640
around going, oh my god, is this all there is?

302
00:20:10.880 --> 00:20:14.039
Like is this, I have this one hundred thousand dollars debt,

303
00:20:14.519 --> 00:20:16.519
and is this what I'm going to do the rest

304
00:20:16.519 --> 00:20:17.039
of my life?

305
00:20:17.519 --> 00:20:17.759
You know.

306
00:20:17.880 --> 00:20:22.960
So it's not just people our age, doctor Doug, but

307
00:20:23.039 --> 00:20:25.359
it's also you know, it can also be young people,

308
00:20:25.440 --> 00:20:28.000
just anybody. In fact, I used to work for a

309
00:20:28.039 --> 00:20:31.440
team of cognitive behavioral therapists. So my job was to

310
00:20:31.839 --> 00:20:36.400
interview potential clients or patients and match them to the

311
00:20:36.440 --> 00:20:39.440
right therapist. And I was floored by how many of

312
00:20:39.480 --> 00:20:41.799
these thirty year olds who were in New York City

313
00:20:42.279 --> 00:20:46.519
were asking that existential question, you know, and they they

314
00:20:46.519 --> 00:20:51.039
would even use that word existential and just trying to

315
00:20:51.079 --> 00:20:55.920
figure out who who they are. So, yeah, the I

316
00:20:55.960 --> 00:20:58.680
don't even remember exactly what your first question was.

317
00:20:58.759 --> 00:21:04.279
But yeah, I used to drive my assistance crazy when

318
00:21:04.279 --> 00:21:07.200
I had my dental practice because I would ask multiple.

319
00:21:06.839 --> 00:21:09.279
Questions and there's like, which one are you talking about?

320
00:21:09.799 --> 00:21:13.079
That's one of my trilogies. But but let's go into this.

321
00:21:13.319 --> 00:21:14.680
Let's talk about identity.

322
00:21:15.200 --> 00:21:19.200
Let's talk and I know, identity collapse in and how

323
00:21:19.240 --> 00:21:24.119
do you begin to discover that inner self, that self

324
00:21:24.160 --> 00:21:28.799
that really as people talk about it, has that truth,

325
00:21:28.880 --> 00:21:30.960
that divinity, that light.

326
00:21:31.559 --> 00:21:33.799
How do people get to that point?

327
00:21:34.000 --> 00:21:36.799
And and I guess one of the important things is

328
00:21:36.799 --> 00:21:38.880
is you talk about you know, whether they're in their

329
00:21:38.920 --> 00:21:44.240
thirties or whatever, and thank you for the compliment our age.

330
00:21:45.039 --> 00:21:48.200
So how do how do people get to the point

331
00:21:48.240 --> 00:21:52.440
where they start to discover that? And how important is

332
00:21:52.519 --> 00:21:57.359
that in making the changes in their lives that benefit them?

333
00:21:57.720 --> 00:22:02.160
Yeah, I mean the only way to have true motivation

334
00:22:03.039 --> 00:22:06.079
is to live by live in alignment with your truth.

335
00:22:06.440 --> 00:22:09.079
You know, like a lot of people have goals and

336
00:22:09.119 --> 00:22:11.519
they talk about I just I have to get motivated

337
00:22:11.599 --> 00:22:16.160
to do steps X, Y and z, And if they're

338
00:22:16.200 --> 00:22:20.119
having trouble doing that, it's because they're not doing what

339
00:22:20.200 --> 00:22:24.359
their truth wants them to do. You mentioned having a

340
00:22:24.440 --> 00:22:28.839
theological background and saying he said something about, you know,

341
00:22:28.880 --> 00:22:30.960
I don't know if I'll say some things that you

342
00:22:30.960 --> 00:22:32.880
don't want me to say or whatever, and I don't

343
00:22:32.880 --> 00:22:36.200
know what those things would be. But it's the same thing,

344
00:22:36.440 --> 00:22:40.440
you know, God, I call it source, but it doesn't

345
00:22:40.480 --> 00:22:44.400
really matter what you call it. It's the there's something

346
00:22:44.920 --> 00:22:48.319
that is bigger than me, Like I'm not the boss here,

347
00:22:48.640 --> 00:22:55.279
there's something else that's the boss. And the way to

348
00:22:55.440 --> 00:22:58.960
get at So for me, what I believe, and I

349
00:22:59.000 --> 00:23:01.319
don't impose my blo leaves on anybody, And I think

350
00:23:01.359 --> 00:23:04.079
you can believe something totally different and still get value

351
00:23:04.119 --> 00:23:06.599
out of my book and my process. But what I

352
00:23:06.640 --> 00:23:12.960
personally believe is that we come from source God and

353
00:23:13.880 --> 00:23:17.960
we are here to do something magnificent, brilliant, all of

354
00:23:18.039 --> 00:23:24.640
us are. The gift is or the challenge or that's

355
00:23:25.160 --> 00:23:29.200
gift and challenge is to remember what we came here

356
00:23:29.240 --> 00:23:34.799
to do. And in order to remember, we have to

357
00:23:35.279 --> 00:23:41.960
quiet ourselves. So that first step is quiting the mind. Really,

358
00:23:42.480 --> 00:23:45.359
if you're in a trauma place, it takes a lot

359
00:23:45.400 --> 00:23:50.039
of work to quiet the mind and certain your nervous

360
00:23:50.079 --> 00:23:53.119
system has to settle a little before I think this

361
00:23:53.279 --> 00:23:58.559
is even conceivable, and meditation helps with that. But the

362
00:23:59.480 --> 00:24:03.240
problem with that word is that the word meditation is

363
00:24:03.279 --> 00:24:05.920
that it freaks people out, and a lot of times

364
00:24:06.119 --> 00:24:09.519
not it freaks people out because they think they can't

365
00:24:09.559 --> 00:24:14.480
do it. There, you know, sort of the you know,

366
00:24:15.000 --> 00:24:21.240
general stereotype of meditation, you know, sitting cross legged and saying, oh,

367
00:24:21.359 --> 00:24:24.519
you know, that is a really hard kind of meditation,

368
00:24:24.920 --> 00:24:28.839
you know, super super hard. And I tried that back

369
00:24:28.880 --> 00:24:30.759
when I wrote the book the first time back in

370
00:24:30.799 --> 00:24:34.839
the nineties, and I felt like a failure because I

371
00:24:34.839 --> 00:24:37.119
could never turn off monkey mind.

372
00:24:37.400 --> 00:24:37.599
Right.

373
00:24:39.279 --> 00:24:43.400
Fortunately, there are more types of meditation out there than

374
00:24:43.440 --> 00:24:47.079
you can count. Even walking through the forest and paying

375
00:24:47.119 --> 00:24:50.119
attention to the rustle of the leaves and your footsteps

376
00:24:50.119 --> 00:24:53.400
on the pavement and your dog panting next to you,

377
00:24:53.799 --> 00:24:59.119
that is meditation. Eating your food with mindfulness, you know,

378
00:24:59.240 --> 00:25:04.599
really tasting and experiencing the different textures of the oatmeal

379
00:25:04.640 --> 00:25:07.359
and the fruit and the protein powder and the nuts

380
00:25:07.400 --> 00:25:11.519
and the like. Really like not watching TV while you're eating,

381
00:25:11.640 --> 00:25:14.960
not scrolling on your phone while you're eating, but actually

382
00:25:15.079 --> 00:25:20.920
experiencing eating. That is meditation. So it doesn't have to

383
00:25:20.960 --> 00:25:25.759
be this far off thing that is so hard to attain. Prayer,

384
00:25:26.200 --> 00:25:30.759
you know, prayer is meditation, but finding the one that

385
00:25:30.839 --> 00:25:33.680
works for you and there will. The one that finally

386
00:25:33.720 --> 00:25:39.240
worked for me was a meditation process that doctor Joe

387
00:25:39.240 --> 00:25:43.839
Despenza uses. But I don't do that meditation anymore because

388
00:25:43.920 --> 00:25:47.640
now I want something different. But I'll probably go back

389
00:25:47.680 --> 00:25:50.400
to his later, you know. So it's not like there's

390
00:25:50.440 --> 00:25:53.599
one kind for you. It's there's one kind for you

391
00:25:53.759 --> 00:25:57.799
now that will resonate more, and that may change and evolve,

392
00:25:58.039 --> 00:26:02.599
and to be afraid of it, that there's there's something

393
00:26:02.640 --> 00:26:03.680
that will work for you.

394
00:26:04.039 --> 00:26:06.319
Quite and you know, it's interesting.

395
00:26:06.400 --> 00:26:09.960
I've done Doctor Joe's too, and it's interesting how you

396
00:26:10.000 --> 00:26:11.880
do get to a point where right, I want to

397
00:26:12.440 --> 00:26:15.880
move in a slightly different direction. And yeah, I love

398
00:26:15.920 --> 00:26:19.079
my walking meditations. I do those at least three times

399
00:26:19.119 --> 00:26:24.039
a week for over an hour and have found places

400
00:26:24.039 --> 00:26:27.400
that I can go with beautiful lakes and the trees

401
00:26:27.599 --> 00:26:31.000
and so forth. So and then listening. And what I

402
00:26:31.039 --> 00:26:34.559
have found is I've done all sorts of things, so

403
00:26:34.720 --> 00:26:38.319
vigil and you know, bineural, all of those things. I

404
00:26:38.359 --> 00:26:41.519
have found for me, what seems to resonate most is

405
00:26:42.200 --> 00:26:45.720
singing bowls and so I went on YouTube and downloaded

406
00:26:46.680 --> 00:26:49.799
you know, some of those. And so I think it's

407
00:26:49.839 --> 00:26:53.519
important for people to understand, as you say, prayer also,

408
00:26:53.599 --> 00:26:57.480
and I find I combine that. Actually, I think meditation

409
00:26:57.599 --> 00:27:00.480
and prayer can be combined. But I think the point is,

410
00:27:00.480 --> 00:27:04.000
as you say, the mindset, the fact that you take

411
00:27:04.039 --> 00:27:09.759
yourself out of this everyday constant bombardment of thoughts and

412
00:27:09.880 --> 00:27:12.559
all the noises and all of that and get to

413
00:27:12.599 --> 00:27:15.359
the point where you can, as some people say, be

414
00:27:15.519 --> 00:27:20.440
still and just start to listen to that inner voice

415
00:27:21.039 --> 00:27:24.680
and realize that you know what there is, that intervoice's

416
00:27:24.720 --> 00:27:26.599
available to you if you just take the.

417
00:27:26.599 --> 00:27:27.519
Time to listen.

418
00:27:28.079 --> 00:27:30.720
And yeah, sometimes you're going to listen and do something

419
00:27:30.720 --> 00:27:33.680
to go, oh, that was a mistake, but guess what,

420
00:27:33.759 --> 00:27:36.119
that's how you begin to learn. And oftentimes what we

421
00:27:36.200 --> 00:27:39.000
think are mistakes. I mean, you look at your situation.

422
00:27:39.160 --> 00:27:42.319
I look at you know, my situation in history, and

423
00:27:42.799 --> 00:27:44.319
can look at things and say.

424
00:27:44.079 --> 00:27:45.519
Wow, that was a mistake.

425
00:27:46.119 --> 00:27:48.519
Or we can look at things and go, I'm so

426
00:27:48.720 --> 00:27:51.079
grateful because here's what I've learned.

427
00:27:51.599 --> 00:27:54.400
And because I've learned this, now I can.

428
00:27:54.400 --> 00:27:57.279
Make a difference in other people's lives, and I think

429
00:27:57.319 --> 00:27:59.240
that's important for people to understand.

430
00:27:59.480 --> 00:28:01.039
You know, I was on your website.

431
00:28:01.319 --> 00:28:04.480
I found the comment that you made in and I

432
00:28:04.480 --> 00:28:06.559
want to go over in a minute. It says you've

433
00:28:06.599 --> 00:28:11.599
spent your life molding to others expectations. You've exhausted by

434
00:28:11.720 --> 00:28:14.599
roles that never quite feel right, and you know that

435
00:28:14.640 --> 00:28:16.359
there's more to you, but you don't know how to

436
00:28:16.400 --> 00:28:19.240
reach it. You feel lost, but you haven't given up,

437
00:28:19.640 --> 00:28:22.799
and you know I think that's such an important.

438
00:28:22.319 --> 00:28:23.640
Thing for people to understand.

439
00:28:23.640 --> 00:28:26.240
And this is I think where awareness comes in is

440
00:28:27.039 --> 00:28:30.480
in this first line, you've spent your life molding to

441
00:28:30.559 --> 00:28:34.759
others expectations. Talk about that a little bit, your experience

442
00:28:34.839 --> 00:28:37.960
and what you have observed with other people. Because as

443
00:28:38.000 --> 00:28:42.400
you're going through this divorce counseling. I don't know, but

444
00:28:42.480 --> 00:28:45.599
I would assume that you have to get into that

445
00:28:46.200 --> 00:28:51.519
inner self of becoming and realizing that you have become

446
00:28:51.599 --> 00:28:53.880
molded to someone else's expectations.

447
00:28:54.319 --> 00:28:58.240
Yeah, and actually we all do it all of the time, right,

448
00:28:58.400 --> 00:29:03.680
it's you know, I I think sometimes once we start

449
00:29:03.799 --> 00:29:10.759
to realize that molding, we experienced shame, you know, like

450
00:29:10.839 --> 00:29:13.319
how could I do that? Or you know, why did

451
00:29:13.319 --> 00:29:19.160
I do that? But there's a uh survival mechanism that

452
00:29:19.839 --> 00:29:25.759
all of this molding originated from, you know, so you know,

453
00:29:25.839 --> 00:29:30.640
maybe like severe independence is to you know, keep you

454
00:29:30.680 --> 00:29:35.240
from getting hurt by others. You know that the molding

455
00:29:35.400 --> 00:29:41.039
came about as an adaptation or as a survival strategy,

456
00:29:41.680 --> 00:29:43.599
and we all do it, and so there's no shame

457
00:29:43.680 --> 00:29:48.359
in any of that. And but but it is so

458
00:29:48.640 --> 00:29:54.640
the step after fighting the mind is awareness, and that

459
00:29:54.759 --> 00:30:01.079
is awareness of everything. It's awareness of yourself and you're

460
00:30:01.640 --> 00:30:04.359
so that that loop and I've heard some of your

461
00:30:04.400 --> 00:30:07.960
other podcasters talk about this, and Doctor Joe talks about it.

462
00:30:08.000 --> 00:30:16.279
But the thought, feeling, behavior, experience loop that we get

463
00:30:16.519 --> 00:30:22.200
stuck in that loop. If you can become aware of

464
00:30:22.240 --> 00:30:26.960
it as it's happening, which if you practice quieting the

465
00:30:27.039 --> 00:30:33.079
mind you can start to do. Once you break that loop,

466
00:30:33.440 --> 00:30:37.920
you can start to be more intentional and conscious about

467
00:30:38.200 --> 00:30:44.079
your experience, your your reality. So yeah, so the molding,

468
00:30:44.200 --> 00:30:46.759
I mean that that happens to everyone all the time.

469
00:30:47.200 --> 00:30:53.599
It happens more severely or we get more lost in

470
00:30:53.640 --> 00:30:58.079
it when we're being controlled and manipulated and gaslighted and

471
00:30:58.119 --> 00:31:01.079
you know, all that stuff. But it's there for everyone.

472
00:31:01.279 --> 00:31:04.480
There's nobody that hasn't, you know, maybe a baby right

473
00:31:04.519 --> 00:31:08.119
when they pop out, but soon after being on this

474
00:31:08.240 --> 00:31:11.200
planet they start to mold as well, you know.

475
00:31:11.799 --> 00:31:18.400
And we are the effect of society of you know, parenting,

476
00:31:19.359 --> 00:31:23.680
even that intentional good parenting. Whereas I said, you know,

477
00:31:23.839 --> 00:31:26.240
for me and I think I was a pretty good parent,

478
00:31:26.319 --> 00:31:28.440
my kids will say I am. But at the same time,

479
00:31:28.519 --> 00:31:32.480
we still have those discussions about their perception and the

480
00:31:32.480 --> 00:31:37.160
things that I unknowingly communicated, the words I use, the

481
00:31:37.200 --> 00:31:42.599
attitude I expressed that caused them to become molded or

482
00:31:42.640 --> 00:31:48.079
to develop that inner belief system that ultimately starts to

483
00:31:48.119 --> 00:31:50.839
show later on in their lives. And I think that

484
00:31:50.839 --> 00:31:53.279
that's so important that we recognize that, you know what

485
00:31:53.799 --> 00:31:56.400
it isn't as you say, it's not our fault, and

486
00:31:57.599 --> 00:32:01.960
this whole concept of original badness and all of that

487
00:32:02.279 --> 00:32:05.920
is it just doesn't exist. And it's just like we

488
00:32:06.039 --> 00:32:12.839
really are that child of the divine and recognizing that

489
00:32:13.160 --> 00:32:17.440
we have become molded, we have become that chameleon, We

490
00:32:17.599 --> 00:32:22.160
become that fake person, not even aware that that's not

491
00:32:22.240 --> 00:32:24.799
ourselves until at some point in time, as you say,

492
00:32:24.960 --> 00:32:29.359
we have that sudden awareness that, Wow, what I'm experiencing here,

493
00:32:29.519 --> 00:32:32.319
whether it's the job or life or whatever.

494
00:32:32.480 --> 00:32:34.240
Isn't who I really am.

495
00:32:35.000 --> 00:32:38.039
In any stories that you can share with people that

496
00:32:38.079 --> 00:32:40.599
you've worked with, where you've been able to work with

497
00:32:40.640 --> 00:32:46.160
them and seen a dramatic change in their lives, yeah.

498
00:32:45.880 --> 00:32:51.960
I think as I reflect through several of them, the

499
00:32:52.559 --> 00:33:00.440
consistent shift in their life has been around punch atribution.

500
00:33:01.079 --> 00:33:08.519
Usually my dog is barking? Is that bothering? You okay, okay,

501
00:33:08.759 --> 00:33:12.920
let me pick back up. Is usually in the form

502
00:33:13.240 --> 00:33:19.160
of contribution, where I think use the words child of

503
00:33:19.200 --> 00:33:23.559
the divine. You know, once they get a glimpse of

504
00:33:23.640 --> 00:33:26.920
that part of them that is the child of the divine,

505
00:33:27.400 --> 00:33:32.480
they they have a message delivered to them in whatever

506
00:33:32.680 --> 00:33:38.119
form that tells them what they're supposed to give back.

507
00:33:38.240 --> 00:33:43.599
And it usually has something to do with creative expression

508
00:33:43.799 --> 00:33:50.599
or healing or uh, you know, contributing to the welfare

509
00:33:50.799 --> 00:33:56.759
of somebody else. Like it's it's always around that. And actually,

510
00:33:57.319 --> 00:33:59.680
you know, one of you said something about when you

511
00:33:59.720 --> 00:34:04.720
were talking talking about mistakes or like, you know, we

512
00:34:04.799 --> 00:34:09.079
tend to think, oh, was that a mistake? And it

513
00:34:09.159 --> 00:34:13.199
made me think of and and I this isn't what

514
00:34:13.239 --> 00:34:15.840
you were necessarily saying in that moment, but something you

515
00:34:15.880 --> 00:34:17.880
were saying right before that made me think of this,

516
00:34:18.760 --> 00:34:24.559
which which is when we hear a message, if it

517
00:34:24.639 --> 00:34:34.079
is critical, doubtful, catastrophic, negative, that is not the child

518
00:34:34.159 --> 00:34:37.280
of the divine, that is our monkey boin that is

519
00:34:37.599 --> 00:34:42.000
our parents or our teachers or whatever. If we're hearing

520
00:34:42.119 --> 00:34:55.360
something that is supportive in you know, enlivening, empowering, exciting, uh, joyous,

521
00:34:56.960 --> 00:35:02.119
you know, praising that is the child of the divine.

522
00:35:02.159 --> 00:35:07.719
Yes, And even in relationships, recognizing that whoever you are

523
00:35:07.880 --> 00:35:11.360
having to have that relationship with, if you are getting

524
00:35:11.400 --> 00:35:16.039
as you experienced, that control, that unkindness, all those types

525
00:35:16.079 --> 00:35:20.199
of things, Recognizing that, you know what, this isn't about me,

526
00:35:20.880 --> 00:35:23.880
this is something that they are having that challenge with,

527
00:35:24.320 --> 00:35:28.119
And I think that becomes the beginning of the awareness

528
00:35:28.280 --> 00:35:30.599
that Okay, you know what, I can step away from

529
00:35:30.599 --> 00:35:34.079
this for a minute, even if it's just mentally and

530
00:35:34.920 --> 00:35:38.079
you know, step away from this and realize that's not me,

531
00:35:38.400 --> 00:35:42.639
and then to start that discovery process of who am I.

532
00:35:43.760 --> 00:35:46.280
So I want to go back to I love the stories.

533
00:35:46.360 --> 00:35:49.480
Any stories. Are just not comfortable telling a story about

534
00:35:49.519 --> 00:35:50.280
someone that I.

535
00:35:50.199 --> 00:35:52.119
Am an open book and an open book.

536
00:35:52.000 --> 00:35:55.440
That you've worked with that literally what they were facing

537
00:35:55.679 --> 00:35:57.960
and how you help them and what their outcome was.

538
00:35:58.519 --> 00:36:03.559
I do have tate to tell specific stories, which is

539
00:36:03.599 --> 00:36:08.000
why I tend to kind of lump the picture altogether,

540
00:36:11.159 --> 00:36:15.840
because usually when you get into the deep details, if

541
00:36:15.840 --> 00:36:26.199
they're specific enough, I just worry about treading on, you know, privacy. Yeah,

542
00:36:26.320 --> 00:36:30.599
if it's about me, I'll share anything, but about other people,

543
00:36:30.639 --> 00:36:34.239
I'm just a little bit more more cautious about that.

544
00:36:34.519 --> 00:36:38.000
Well, as you began to develop that mindset, as you

545
00:36:38.079 --> 00:36:41.719
went to I'm sure, as you became certified in different

546
00:36:41.719 --> 00:36:44.280
areas obviously, as you went to doctor Joe, which is

547
00:36:44.400 --> 00:36:47.679
very enlightening if you went to some of his programs,

548
00:36:48.000 --> 00:36:51.280
at what point in time and how on earth did

549
00:36:51.320 --> 00:36:57.039
you end up ending that relationship that was so psychologically

550
00:36:57.079 --> 00:36:57.840
abusive to you.

551
00:36:58.480 --> 00:37:01.639
The visual I have in my head is not exactly

552
00:37:01.719 --> 00:37:08.000
what happened. What it felt like, I crawled on for pause,

553
00:37:08.480 --> 00:37:11.559
you know, out the door, and pulled myself into my

554
00:37:11.719 --> 00:37:14.519
car and drove off. That's what it felt like. But

555
00:37:15.079 --> 00:37:20.320
what it really looked like was I went back to

556
00:37:20.400 --> 00:37:25.159
the therapist that did trauma therapy with me to save

557
00:37:25.239 --> 00:37:29.599
my marriage. She didn't want to go to couples counseling

558
00:37:29.599 --> 00:37:33.559
at first. She wound up sort of half ass trying later,

559
00:37:34.079 --> 00:37:37.920
but I went to the therapist to save my marriage,

560
00:37:37.960 --> 00:37:40.400
and then the process of that woke up to the

561
00:37:40.480 --> 00:37:44.840
fact that no, that is not what I needed to do,

562
00:37:44.880 --> 00:37:47.880
and I needed to get out. But because I was

563
00:37:48.599 --> 00:37:53.800
trapped in a psychological abuse, I didn't realize I could leave.

564
00:37:53.960 --> 00:38:00.800
So I asked for a divorce and was told that, uh,

565
00:38:00.880 --> 00:38:03.400
it wasn't a good time, basically that we had to

566
00:38:03.440 --> 00:38:09.960
wait until some random time summer. And I then came

567
00:38:10.000 --> 00:38:13.360
back with a place I wanted to move to, and

568
00:38:13.440 --> 00:38:17.239
I had made sure that it was close enough we

569
00:38:17.239 --> 00:38:20.440
could share custody of the pets, and you know, the

570
00:38:20.519 --> 00:38:22.840
cost was reasonable and blah blah blah, and I was

571
00:38:22.880 --> 00:38:26.960
told I couldn't. I couldn't move out. The reason that

572
00:38:27.119 --> 00:38:34.079
was given was basically financial control, and so I acquiesced

573
00:38:34.119 --> 00:38:37.400
to that. So I went out and found an even

574
00:38:37.559 --> 00:38:43.800
cheaper place and more less desirable place, but again furnish

575
00:38:43.840 --> 00:38:47.280
would take the dogs. Less expensive. Still told Nope, too much,

576
00:38:47.320 --> 00:38:51.800
you can't move out. And I was sharing this with

577
00:38:52.320 --> 00:38:57.079
a friend, well, you know, talking about how the trapped

578
00:38:57.079 --> 00:39:00.480
I felt, and she we're on a walk and she

579
00:39:00.599 --> 00:39:02.480
just sort of stopped and looked at me and said,

580
00:39:02.840 --> 00:39:05.719
you're a fifty five year old woman. You don't need

581
00:39:05.800 --> 00:39:08.679
her permission. And it was like this bucket of cold

582
00:39:08.800 --> 00:39:11.960
water just splashed on my face. That had never occurred

583
00:39:12.000 --> 00:39:14.559
to me that I could leave, that I didn't need

584
00:39:14.639 --> 00:39:18.239
her permission. So I realized I wasn't going to be

585
00:39:18.280 --> 00:39:21.480
able to leave if she was home, and you know

586
00:39:21.599 --> 00:39:24.719
this is not I like admitting I did this, but

587
00:39:24.880 --> 00:39:28.679
I did. She went out of town. I found a

588
00:39:28.760 --> 00:39:33.480
furnished house, I packed up my car, drove the stuff

589
00:39:33.679 --> 00:39:38.199
in the pets there and emailed her. And you left

590
00:39:39.599 --> 00:39:41.920
because it was the only way I could get help,

591
00:39:42.159 --> 00:39:42.320
you know.

592
00:39:42.440 --> 00:39:43.480
And that's a great story.

593
00:39:43.519 --> 00:39:46.239
And I think it's important for people to understand that

594
00:39:46.920 --> 00:39:50.679
sometimes you have to be dramatic in your life in

595
00:39:50.760 --> 00:39:54.760
order to get out of these situations. And the fact

596
00:39:54.760 --> 00:39:57.639
that you worked so hard with you know, going to

597
00:39:57.719 --> 00:40:00.480
therapist to try to save it, and then it realizing

598
00:40:00.599 --> 00:40:02.840
ultimately that you know what is not going to work.

599
00:40:02.920 --> 00:40:05.599
So as we as we run out of time here,

600
00:40:05.639 --> 00:40:07.559
and we could go on for quite a while. I

601
00:40:07.599 --> 00:40:11.800
think I'm loving your discussion here. What would be that

602
00:40:11.920 --> 00:40:15.519
final message that you'd like to share with those that

603
00:40:15.559 --> 00:40:16.559
are listening today.

604
00:40:17.039 --> 00:40:21.320
The art of hearing your truth doesn't have to be

605
00:40:21.719 --> 00:40:25.920
super time coming. It can be taken in little bites,

606
00:40:26.239 --> 00:40:31.280
the little moments of breath of quiet. My book is

607
00:40:31.360 --> 00:40:36.239
divided into sections with exercises questions to get at your truth.

608
00:40:36.599 --> 00:40:40.840
You can do a question a day, an exercise a week,

609
00:40:41.119 --> 00:40:43.960
and whether that's with my tools or some other tools.

610
00:40:43.960 --> 00:40:46.639
It doesn't really matter. The point is you don't have

611
00:40:46.719 --> 00:40:49.920
to spend five hours a day up on a mountain

612
00:40:51.039 --> 00:40:55.440
to get your truth, know your passion and what you're

613
00:40:55.480 --> 00:40:56.360
here to bring.

614
00:40:56.199 --> 00:40:56.960
To the wonderful.

615
00:40:57.199 --> 00:40:57.960
Okay, thank you?

616
00:40:58.079 --> 00:41:00.920
And so how do people find you? And how will

617
00:41:00.920 --> 00:41:02.440
people be able to find your book?

618
00:41:03.320 --> 00:41:06.760
The book is on Amazon and again it's called Be

619
00:41:06.960 --> 00:41:11.239
the You That's More You than You've Ever been. It's

620
00:41:11.280 --> 00:41:17.559
a big book and the website pair of more paradox

621
00:41:17.800 --> 00:41:21.920
and it's spelled one way, but I think I've got

622
00:41:21.960 --> 00:41:26.159
all the wrong spellings also routed to it, but I'm

623
00:41:26.199 --> 00:41:27.880
sure you'll include it in the notes.

624
00:41:28.119 --> 00:41:31.920
Yes, yes, all right, Christen, thank you so much. This

625
00:41:32.360 --> 00:41:36.159
has been really insightful. And your transparency, I think it's

626
00:41:36.239 --> 00:41:39.760
so important and for people to understand that as we

627
00:41:39.920 --> 00:41:43.159
learn to become more transparent, not only do we begin

628
00:41:43.239 --> 00:41:47.599
to understand who we truly are, but the value that

629
00:41:47.679 --> 00:41:51.960
we give to other people by doing that is so important.

630
00:41:52.320 --> 00:41:55.639
So thank you, Thank you, doctor Doug, thank you you.

631
00:41:55.800 --> 00:41:57.440
Ed, and folks, thanks for listening.

632
00:41:58.039 --> 00:42:00.679
I hope you've enjoyed this one and look forward to

633
00:42:00.719 --> 00:42:03.199
having you join us again soon. So this is doctor Dyke,

634
00:42:03.280 --> 00:42:06.159
saying no mistake.