July 29, 2024

Align With Our True Selves

Align With Our True Selves

There are many approaches to therapy in helping an individual to free themselves from past negative imprints to a life of happiness and fulfillment.
Harmony Kwiker is an individual who has experienced that in her own life and, as a psychotherapist,...

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There are many approaches to therapy in helping an individual to free themselves from past negative imprints to a life of happiness and fulfillment.
Harmony Kwiker is an individual who has experienced that in her own life and, as a psychotherapist, has discovered an amazing and not too common approach to help people reach their true potential.
She has also written a book, Align: Living and Loving from the True Self, where she outlines that approach.
https://www.thespirituallyaligned.com

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This program is designed to provide general information with regards

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to the subject matters covered. This information is given with

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the understanding that neither the hosts, guests, sponsors, or station

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are engaged in rendering any specific and personal medical, financial,

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legal counseling, professional service, or any advice. You should seek

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the services of competent professionals before applying or trying any

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suggested ideas.

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At the end of the day, it's not about what

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you have or even what you've accomplished. It's about what

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you've done with those accomplishments. It's about who you've lifted up,

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who you've made better. It's about what you've given back.

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Denzel Washington, Welcome to Inspire Vision. Our sole purpose is

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to elevate the lives of others and to inspire you to.

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Do the same.

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Har Many, Welcome to the show.

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Hi, doctor Doug, thank you so much for having me.

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Hey, it's great to have you on the show. This

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is something that I'm really fascinated about because I know

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you're doing things a little bit differently than a lot

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of psychotherapists and other people that are doing to help people,

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and so I'm really fascinated about how this is going

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to go. I want your story though, because I find

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that that's always interesting to the audience is who are

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you and how did you get to this point and

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what motivated you to move in this direction and also

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what motivated you to write that latest book of yours ALIGNE.

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Yeah, So I grew up in a family of healers,

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and I was surrounded and like really steeped in a

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culture of personal growth throughout my entire life. My mom,

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she was a breath worker and a coach, and she

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would lead these workshops in our home that fascinated me

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and I actually I started practicing transcendental meditation when I

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was six. She had me initiated into the practice of

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trans and dental meditation, and I also started doing breath

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work around the age of eighteen and assisting in her workshops.

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And my dad as a physician who has a really

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alternative approach to health and empowering his patients, and I

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watched them living their purpose and I loved being in that,

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you know, swimming in that energetic school, so to speak.

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But whenever I was suffering, I would go seek out

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psychotherapy and I was really disappointed. I didn't like the

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way I felt I didn't like the things therapist said

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to me, quite honestly, and I was confused that why

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the place where most people seek support and transformation and

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healing seems so limited to me. And so when it

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was time to go to college, I majored in psychology

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and loved what I was learning, and I assisted in

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a lot of research and really dove into the psychology department.

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But I was still wondering, like, how can I bridge

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this divide between all of this personal growth transformation that

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I knew was possible that I had experienced outside of

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a clinical space, but how could I bring that into

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a counseling container. And so when I started studying clinical

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psychology and graduate school, I started to like scratch the surface.

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I learned spiritual psychology and gestalt and psycho synthesis, which

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are all very trans personal models of counseling, which, for

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those who are listening, trans personal psychology is really about

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being with clients beyond the personality. So as a therapist,

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I'm not engaging from my personality and I'm not engaging

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with my client's personality. Where in the trans personal realm

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where transcendent experiences happen. And I was fascinated with transpersonal counseling,

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but I still wasn't quite sure the real clinical application,

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Like how can I really hold space in a way

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that offers my clients a space to come back to

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their true nature, to the truth of who they are.

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And I dedicated many, many, many years of my career

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finding my way to be that type of spaceholder and

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eventually found my way to teaching Gestalt at Europa University

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here in Boulder, Colorado. And I'm so in love with

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psychology now and counseling, which is which is just such

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a wonderful surprise, because I started off so dissatisfied and

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I'm now thoroughly in love with transpersonal counseling, especially teaching

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student therapists. It's just a wonderful space to be in.

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Oh, that's wonderful. And you talk about gestalt, can you

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can you describe what type of therapy that is?

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Yeah, Gestalt is a trans personal approach to counseling that

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really focuses on the here and now, present moment. The

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belief is that relationship happens in the present moment, healing

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happens in the present moment, and so why many therapy

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focuses on the past and the history and analyzing how

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a person came to be. Gestalt therapists are really focusing

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on how a client is disrupting contact with themselves and

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the environment in the present moment, and any disruption to

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contact of presence becomes the entry point to transformation. And

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it's a very experimental, experiential approach to counseling where we

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sort of rearrange the therapeutic container in dynamic ways, so

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we're not always just sitting talking. We're doing a lot

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of different things, and really magical experiences can unfold and

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really deep repair within a client system.

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Well, and you know, it's interesting because you talk about

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how a lot of therapy, and obviously a lot of

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psychology therapy is just talk therapy, and as you say,

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I mean, I've been there too. It's just so frustrating

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because nothing's getting accomplished and you're just talking, talking, talking,

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whereas as you're starting to really focus on something a

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little bit different that works. But as you talk about

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not going into the past to focus on that, at

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the same time, isn't it true that those subconscious imprints

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are literally creating our lives? And so I'm curious how

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with gestal. You're in the present, here and now, and

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yet you're still able to go in and deal with

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those past imprints that are still existing in present time. Yeah,

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you're right, they exist in present time exactly.

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That's exactly it. Yeah, we call it unfinished business in gestalt.

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And so what is incomplete from the past, like an

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experience where a need wasn't fully met in the past.

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The ways living in the present moment through what we

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call contact boundary disturbances, so disruptions to the present moment contact.

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The way they live in a person systems system now

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is actually a rigid, rigid way of thinking and behaving

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that when it was created in the past was really adaptive.

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The person created safety and homeostasis within a system that

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wasn't designed for their well being. But then it becomes

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a rigid pattern, a rigid way of being, and a

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person is wondering, like, why is my experience of myself

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so limited? Why do I keep doing the same thing,

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Why do I keep sabotaging my relationships, et cetera. Those patterns,

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they are seated in the past, but the way they

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show up now is really how we're working with them.

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So we're not looking behind us. We're looking into what

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I call spiritual time, where the energy of that version

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of ourselves is right now in this moment.

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Well, and you know, you talk about the energy and

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version of ourselves and I think for a lot of

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people they don't really understand what that means. So from

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your perspective, who are we? Who are we? And how

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do we get back to that situation of really being

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who we are?

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Yeah, we are multi dimensional beings, and we are dynamic,

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and we are ever evolving. We're not stagnant. And I

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think that when people feel stuck, it's because they think

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they're stagnant and they're orienting to a way of being

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that served them once but no longer really serves who

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they're becoming. And so when our nervous system is disregulated,

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the way that we try to find safety is to

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control the world around us or to manage ourselves. And

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when we are you know, engaging in these behaviors that

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are really coming from a trauma response of feeling scared

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or angry or you know, fawning, trying to make everybody happy,

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we are we're keeping ourselves disregulated while we're actually trying

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to regulate. It can be a little confusing because those

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are actually attempts at regulation. Trying to get other people

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to like us or to be okay with everything is

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an attempt at regulation, but it keeps us in a

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perpetual state of dysregulation, which keeps us from being present.

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So the more available we can be for our experience,

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the more we can actually regulate our nervous system and

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find our way back to a healthy, aware state where

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we're more connected and aligned with our true nature.

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Interesting, and you know, it comes to mind mind that

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I've observed some people that you know, as you talk

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about people who are depressed or you know, struggling, or

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they find that they self sabotage, and that's one element

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of what they do. But also I noticed that there

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are some that constantly attract the same type of people,

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the same type of experience, and then they find themselves

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in what I would say the victim mode of you know,

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well they did this to me, and they did that

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to me, and they find themselves in that mode. How

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how does that work? How does it work that people

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find and attract the very same things that they're really

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trying to avoid it, yet they keep attracting it.

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It's such a good question, and I think it's really

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the plight of so many people, especially if they think

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that they're doing something different, like they go and find

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a different relationship or move locals, and they think that

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they're doing something different and that they're going to attract

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a different experience, and then they're in the same cycle.

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And you know, as I'm listening to a quote from

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one of the creators of Geshtal therapy, Fritz Pearls, comes

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to mind, and he famously says, we live in a

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house of mirrors, thinking we're looking out windows. So that

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is to say that when we think that the people

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outside of us are separate from us, and we look

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to them to have a different experience of ourselves, we're

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actually getting pulled further away from the solution to our

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healing and our transformation. That really looking within and seeing

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how is this person actually a reflection of my wound

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or a reflection of my condition self, so that I

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can learn and integrate and heal and feel more whole

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and connect with my true source of love within myself

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and then show up from that place. It's it's a

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delicate balance though, because I really I would not ever

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want a victim blame like there are some dynamics where

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it's just a truly unhealthy relationship, and removing ourselves is

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the most important thing that we can do for ourselves.

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And yet each experience that we have is such a beautiful,

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sacred opportunity to deepen into contact with ourselves, to come

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home to ourselves even more. I remember, I remember a gohead.

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I was just going to say, I remember when I

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had this epiphany, because you know, I'm a human being,

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and I I had this experience many times in my

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life where I'm in a different relationship and I think

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this is going to be it, this is going to

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be the different experience. And I had this epiphany one

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day that I kept attracting these abusive relationships because the

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men that I was in a relationship with were a

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reflection of my own self hate. And it wasn't until

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I could be with my own self loathing in a

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way that was loving and healing that I would never

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ever allow myself to endure such such an experience and

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call it love.

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Well, And why do we see some people get into

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these codependent relationships where and you know, at the worst

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part of it, they're really experiencing abuse. They truly are

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a victim, and I don't want to take away from that.

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They're victims. They're experiencing that, and yet they stay or

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they leave and then they come back. And what is

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it that causes that codependency that they are not able

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to literally say, as you did, enough is enough, I'm

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out of here, and then really remain out of there.

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Yeah. So the neurobiology of especially the female nervous system,

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but of all nervous systems is that when we when

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we don't have a perceived sense of power, especially you know,

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intergenerationally and you know through through time, we the safest

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place for us to be is in what's called a

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fawning response, which is the last place the nervous system

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goes to find a sense of safety, which means to

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stay here, to not do anything, to disrupt the status quo,

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to be okay with everything, and it's and it's really

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a trauma response. It's a way to try to find safety.

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And the less power we have in society, and especially

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perceived power, the more likely we are to stay in fawning.

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Well, and as you say, you you managed to break

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out of that. But as you're working with people, how

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do you help them literally to get to that point

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where they have the courage to break away and disconnect

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from not only that individual victim type of situation, but

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also in many cases the friends, the people surrounding them

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that are literally doing the same thing that maybe an

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individual is doing, at least from any Martians standpoints.

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Yeah, the short answer is therapeutic, and this happens over

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time therapeutically. But the short answer here is I help

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people to become a secure base for themselves, to give

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themselves what it is that they're hoping other people will

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give them. So if they're looking for safety from other people,

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how can they be a safe space for themselves, If

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they're looking for love and acceptance outside of themselves, how

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can they love and accept themselves and to keep deepening

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into becoming a secure base for their own for their

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own heart, for their own spirit. So that when you know,

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it comes down to it, what does it mean to

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be a safe space for myself? If I'm truly a

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safe space for myself, am I going to keep letting

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myself be abused? If I truly love myself? And am

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I going to keep enjoy criticism and emotional abuse? So

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the more a person can love themselves and to really

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hold themselves and what's true for them as opposed to

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looking outside for other people. To give that to themselves.

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They can then find their way to what is the

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truest thing that they can do to honor themselves and

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to keep themselves really safe.

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Okay, And you talk about how important it is to

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remain in present time rather than going through the past.

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And yet I know personally and as I've talked to others,

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it's been the same experience that you know, we talk

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about consciousness, we talk about mindset. You know, we're in

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the here and now, and those things from the past

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continue to come back, even though we think we've handled

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them or you know, we've gotten rid of them, which

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is some what people say they're trying to do. The

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reality is that they come up again. Occasionally they came up,

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something happens, we get triggered, we get a memory again,

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or an emotion that comes up again. How does that happen?

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And how do we deal with that because it's not

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something like once you I don't know, maybe it is

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with gestall once it's done, it's done, or does it

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keep coming back? But now there's a way that we

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need to handle that consciously.

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Yeah, there's a couple questions I think embedded and what

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you just said. And so the first one that I'll

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speak to is when we're working in the here and now,

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we're actually bringing that inner young one into the present

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moment into the room right now, So maybe in a

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chair or just as if they're sitting in front of

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us and being in relationship in this moment with the

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energetic quality of that inner young one, as opposed to

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looking back and thinking of a picture of what I

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looked like when I was four and talk and even

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thinking about what happened back then when I was four.

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It's really for me about bringing that young one, and

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let's just say that four year old here right now

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and seeing her for her experience, seeing that she felt alone,

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that she felt scared, and loving her in her experience,

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and reparenting and helping to find a new relationship with

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oneself by touching those moments where the wound happened. And

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the other part of that question is, yes, these these

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patterns can re emerge. I see it so often with

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clients where they touch this deeper place inside of themselves

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and they're feeling so solid in themselves and so connected

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and so aligned, and then they fall asleep, you know,

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to their true self again, and their their mind comes

293
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back with these patterns and these thoughts and these narratives

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about other people, and they slipped back into the old pattern,

295
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and they feel so frustrated with themselves, like how did

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I do that again? I was so good? But you know,

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I really believe that each time the pattern emerges, it's

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an opportunity to clarify even further, to see even deeper

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what is embedded within that pattern, What misbelief, what impulse,

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what motivation is needing to be touched by the light

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of consciousness.

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So it's really a matter of rather than being at

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the effect of that continually, you literally become at cause

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or control, so you're the one that is controlling the

305
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experience rather than being at the effect of that experience.

306
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Yeah, I mean, I would say it a little bit differently.

307
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It's more like we're the ones who we're both the

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witness and the person with choice as opposed to being

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asleep and in habitual pattern. And so when we're empowered

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with choice of how we truly are with ourselves and

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with the world, we need to be present in order

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to have that access to that choice. That's where we

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learn to trust our and we actually are owning our

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power in such a way that we have true influence.

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Okay, and so your latest book, which is Aligne and

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then I think it's living and Loving from the yourself.

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I'd like for you to share what is that book

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about and what value could it be to the people

319
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that are listening today.

320
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Yeah, so a Liigne, it's a really comprehensive book. The

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first half of it is about the inner work of

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coming back home to the truth of who you are.

323
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And it's a combination of theory, exercises and personal story.

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I share my story along the way with the theme

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of each chapter. And then the second half of the

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book is about how to bring that into real time

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in your relationships, how to stay connected to yourself as

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you relate to the people in your life. I find

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that in intimate relationships that it's kind of like the

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last frontier of like how can I stay really connected

331
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to myself as I get closer and closer to true intimacy.

332
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It's where all of the patterns to disrupt contacts sort

333
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of come up to the surface and to learn how

334
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to stay connected to ourselves in intimate relating. It's it's

335
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such powerful medicine. And so the thing that I hear

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from readers about a line is that it really helps

337
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them in every aspect of their life, both in their

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internal journey and with their relationships with other people. One

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00:21:37.119 --> 00:21:39.960
reviewer told me that it's that they believe it's the

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equivalent to years and years of quality psychotherapy. It's I

341
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kind of but everything I'm kind of but everything I

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know in that book.

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Well, and you know what, that is so great that

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people literally then from what I'm hearing, people could read

345
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the book and to some degree really manage what's going

346
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on in their lives. For instance, you know, one of

347
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the things I know, how to live from the core

348
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of your being? How do you take your power back

349
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from your conditioned self? So, for instance, with that particular statement,

350
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how do you take your power back from your conditioned self?

351
00:22:15.480 --> 00:22:18.160
If I'm reading the book and you're not there to

352
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guide me, how does that work?

353
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Yeah, I mean that is answered in several chapters because

354
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it's so because it's so multifaceted. It's it begins with

355
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understanding that in the privacy of our own mind, these

356
00:22:35.960 --> 00:22:40.440
acquired beliefs exist and most of us walk around believing

357
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that what we think is reality, and that keeps us

358
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off center from the core of our being. Like, that's

359
00:22:47.039 --> 00:22:50.319
just sort of the first step is recognizing that we

360
00:22:50.359 --> 00:22:54.640
create narratives that keep us from staying connected with our

361
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true self. And and you know, I really do have

362
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a neurobio logical approach to the way I work. And

363
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so there's a lot of teaching there about somatic psychology

364
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and listening to the wisdom of the nervous system and

365
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the wisdom of the body, because that really is a

366
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part of it, because the mind loops and thoughts as

367
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an attempt to regulate, and the more regulated we are,

368
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the more we can come back home and like really

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rest in the truth of who we are.

370
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Well, And as you talk about the neurological aspects of that,

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you know, what comes to my mind is habits, and

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in some respects, you know, I look at it from

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the standpoint of, all right, the way I behave right

374
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now that may be based on those past subconscious experiences

375
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is a habit. It has actually been imprinted into my brain,

376
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and there are neurological pathways that continue to have me

377
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do that. As you have studied that you find that

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as you help them to overcome and to really you know,

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start to eminate some of that type of behavior in

380
00:24:02.319 --> 00:24:06.000
their lives. Does it literally become a new habit? Does

381
00:24:06.039 --> 00:24:08.640
it change in their own pathways to the point where

382
00:24:08.720 --> 00:24:11.279
it actually becomes a new habit?

383
00:24:12.559 --> 00:24:17.319
Absolutely, a person moves into a place of no longer

384
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needing to put intention into doing the different, truer thing

385
00:24:21.160 --> 00:24:24.480
like it just becomes an embodied way of being that

386
00:24:24.480 --> 00:24:29.599
that yes, it's absolutely a new habit, and even to

387
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such a degree that the old habits, you know, just

388
00:24:32.920 --> 00:24:35.960
can can seem so far away and so distant because

389
00:24:36.319 --> 00:24:38.079
the new way of being is so embodied.

390
00:24:39.400 --> 00:24:41.279
Well, and I know one of the other things you

391
00:24:41.359 --> 00:24:43.400
talk about is how do you honor the wholeness of

392
00:24:43.440 --> 00:24:45.839
your being? And you know that gets to be very

393
00:24:45.880 --> 00:24:51.759
complicated as I look at society and culture, and you know,

394
00:24:51.799 --> 00:24:55.200
there are so many ways in which people are taught

395
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that they're really not good. I mean, I think, and

396
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I'm cri but I think from a Christian perspective, you know,

397
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many many of those are saying, you know, the original sin,

398
00:25:06.039 --> 00:25:09.319
you're you're born into sin, and so here you have

399
00:25:09.480 --> 00:25:13.279
this whole concept right from the beginning that I'm you

400
00:25:13.319 --> 00:25:18.000
know that I'm not good, I'm simple. You have other

401
00:25:18.079 --> 00:25:24.960
experiences where, either inadvertently or sometimes purposely, we hear someone

402
00:25:25.039 --> 00:25:27.319
say to us, you know what, You're just so stupid?

403
00:25:27.440 --> 00:25:30.319
How could you do that? And all of a sudden

404
00:25:30.359 --> 00:25:33.720
we developed this whole concept of who we are that

405
00:25:33.920 --> 00:25:38.640
is so not who we really are. And how do

406
00:25:38.680 --> 00:25:43.240
you help people to understand that what they think they

407
00:25:43.279 --> 00:25:46.319
are is not who they really are and help them

408
00:25:46.359 --> 00:25:49.160
to understand who they really are?

409
00:25:50.559 --> 00:25:53.400
You know, I really do believe that most people know

410
00:25:53.559 --> 00:25:56.799
that they I think most people inherently know that what

411
00:25:56.880 --> 00:26:01.599
they think about themselves has been acquired and taught to them.

412
00:26:02.519 --> 00:26:05.160
But what they don't know is what to do with that.

413
00:26:05.880 --> 00:26:09.359
So there's this acquired belief I'm stupid, and it keeps

414
00:26:09.440 --> 00:26:12.559
It's like made its way into my personality, and so

415
00:26:12.720 --> 00:26:16.400
now it guides my thinking and my behavior. What do

416
00:26:16.440 --> 00:26:21.240
I do about that acquired thought? Ingestahalt we call those interjections,

417
00:26:21.319 --> 00:26:24.519
and so we work with introjections in a very conscious way,

418
00:26:24.640 --> 00:26:29.599
because when we take in something whole, some idea from

419
00:26:29.640 --> 00:26:33.079
the environment, and we don't really contemplate it before we

420
00:26:33.119 --> 00:26:37.079
integrate it into who we are. It's a big part

421
00:26:37.119 --> 00:26:40.440
of what has us feel off center from the core

422
00:26:40.480 --> 00:26:42.559
of our being off center from the truth of who

423
00:26:42.559 --> 00:26:46.119
we are. And so I offer a lot of exercises

424
00:26:46.119 --> 00:26:49.759
in a line about working with interjections, because I really

425
00:26:49.839 --> 00:26:51.720
do think that they are at the core of so

426
00:26:51.960 --> 00:26:58.400
much of what keeps people feeling small and stuck in life.

427
00:26:57.680 --> 00:27:00.759
And you're actually able to help them to recognize that

428
00:27:00.759 --> 00:27:04.559
that's all it is, and therefore, in a here and

429
00:27:04.640 --> 00:27:07.160
now be able to say that no longer affects me.

430
00:27:07.880 --> 00:27:11.880
Anything that's been acquired can be given back if we're

431
00:27:11.880 --> 00:27:14.640
doing it from the right place. So if we're rejecting

432
00:27:14.720 --> 00:27:18.599
it out of anger or resentment or fear, it kind

433
00:27:18.599 --> 00:27:20.559
of gives it power and it has us cling to

434
00:27:20.640 --> 00:27:23.799
it a little bit more. But if we first arrive

435
00:27:24.039 --> 00:27:27.559
to our most awakened resource self, and then we are

436
00:27:27.599 --> 00:27:31.720
with these interjections consciously, we can actually have choice about

437
00:27:32.200 --> 00:27:35.759
how to transmute that energy absolutely well.

438
00:27:35.799 --> 00:27:38.119
And you know, one of the things I just wrote

439
00:27:38.119 --> 00:27:41.519
a blog that I did quite a bet of research

440
00:27:41.599 --> 00:27:48.240
on as far as DNA memory, And have you looked

441
00:27:48.240 --> 00:27:51.000
into that at all, and what are your thoughts about,

442
00:27:51.039 --> 00:27:53.799
Because what I've seen, and what I've researched is that

443
00:27:54.000 --> 00:28:00.240
literally I might have a disempowering belief that it has

444
00:28:00.319 --> 00:28:04.680
nothing to do with my personal environment or existence as

445
00:28:04.720 --> 00:28:06.720
a child, that it may have to do with my

446
00:28:06.759 --> 00:28:09.319
great grandfather, my great great grandfather, and all of a

447
00:28:09.359 --> 00:28:12.960
sudden this is coming up. And how do you deal

448
00:28:13.039 --> 00:28:15.160
with that? And do you find that that, in fact,

449
00:28:15.240 --> 00:28:17.240
you've experienced that with your clients.

450
00:28:17.720 --> 00:28:19.920
Absolutely, I love that you just wrote a blog about that.

451
00:28:19.960 --> 00:28:22.599
I write a little bit about epigenetics in a line,

452
00:28:22.599 --> 00:28:26.200
and I do. I think that there's so much beauty

453
00:28:26.240 --> 00:28:29.720
in recognizing that this has been a pattern passed down

454
00:28:30.279 --> 00:28:34.200
that has altered my DNA, that I can actually transmute

455
00:28:34.240 --> 00:28:37.359
my DNA by doing this deep healing work and repair.

456
00:28:38.799 --> 00:28:43.680
I personally love working with ancestral lineage with my clients.

457
00:28:45.119 --> 00:28:46.880
I haven't written about it in a line, but my

458
00:28:46.920 --> 00:28:49.000
third book that's going to be out at the beginning

459
00:28:49.000 --> 00:28:53.960
of next year, I have written about it because there's

460
00:28:54.200 --> 00:28:58.519
you know, there's so much opportunity to have allies when

461
00:28:58.519 --> 00:29:00.640
we start working with ancestral edge.

462
00:29:02.039 --> 00:29:03.920
Well, and how does that work go a little bit

463
00:29:04.000 --> 00:29:05.000
daver if you don't mind.

464
00:29:06.519 --> 00:29:10.160
Yeah, you know, as I was saying before, when we're

465
00:29:10.279 --> 00:29:15.759
working in a trans personal way clinically, we are opening

466
00:29:15.839 --> 00:29:21.119
up to transcendent experiences. And transcendent experiences are non ordinary

467
00:29:21.160 --> 00:29:26.960
states of consciousness, so experiences that the ordinary mind might

468
00:29:27.000 --> 00:29:32.359
not conceive or be able to fully understand or grock.

469
00:29:32.559 --> 00:29:36.119
And so in that experience, when we're in this trans

470
00:29:36.119 --> 00:29:41.880
personal container, that the energy and the consciousness of ancestors

471
00:29:42.599 --> 00:29:46.720
might arrive as support and allies, and sometimes in gestalt

472
00:29:46.799 --> 00:29:49.960
we invite them into a chair and actually just communicate

473
00:29:50.000 --> 00:29:53.920
with them. It's really powerful when clients can feel the

474
00:29:54.039 --> 00:29:56.759
energy themselves, you know, as if the ancestors are there

475
00:29:56.759 --> 00:29:59.960
in the room. The thing is is that, like when

476
00:30:00.119 --> 00:30:03.039
somebody has passed on and they're arriving as an ally,

477
00:30:03.759 --> 00:30:10.359
there's opportunity in the way that they are now without

478
00:30:10.400 --> 00:30:13.359
their personality and without their body and their condition self

479
00:30:13.400 --> 00:30:16.599
that they can actually offer support. And it's really up

480
00:30:16.640 --> 00:30:20.519
to the client to find how that can be meaningful

481
00:30:20.559 --> 00:30:23.000
for them if that's their experience in that moment.

482
00:30:23.839 --> 00:30:27.640
Well, and you talk about allies, but what about those

483
00:30:27.680 --> 00:30:31.119
that are not allies? What about those that have been

484
00:30:31.720 --> 00:30:34.400
just the opposite. For instance, I know that my dad

485
00:30:34.799 --> 00:30:39.960
experienced some abuse as a child and it was interesting,

486
00:30:40.440 --> 00:30:43.440
and I'm not going to keep asking. I asked multiple questions,

487
00:30:43.440 --> 00:30:46.440
so I'm going to stop there. Go back to the original.

488
00:30:46.720 --> 00:30:51.599
So ally, but now you've got someone who's not an ally,

489
00:30:52.079 --> 00:30:55.519
that's an enemy, and how do you deal with that

490
00:30:55.880 --> 00:30:59.519
when that comes to their mind? And how do they react?

491
00:31:00.279 --> 00:31:03.400
Because you know so many people I think get very

492
00:31:04.480 --> 00:31:08.000
very strange feelings about all of a sudden they're remembering

493
00:31:08.160 --> 00:31:11.839
something in their past. It goes back to generations, and

494
00:31:12.160 --> 00:31:14.920
if it's an enemy rather than an ally, how do

495
00:31:15.000 --> 00:31:15.759
they deal with that?

496
00:31:17.000 --> 00:31:20.880
Yeah, my first answer to that is people will only

497
00:31:21.119 --> 00:31:24.000
arrive to whatever they're ready to work with, right, So

498
00:31:24.079 --> 00:31:26.359
I don't have an agenda and I'm not pushing anything.

499
00:31:26.440 --> 00:31:29.000
I'm just opening up the container to see what wants

500
00:31:29.079 --> 00:31:32.519
to happen. And clients are really guiding the session based

501
00:31:32.599 --> 00:31:37.240
on their desire, their intuition, what is true for them,

502
00:31:37.759 --> 00:31:40.319
and I'm sort of following them and guiding them at

503
00:31:40.359 --> 00:31:43.400
the same time. It can be hard to tell who's

504
00:31:43.480 --> 00:31:47.480
doing what sometimes in a session because in the trans

505
00:31:47.599 --> 00:31:52.200
personal we're in what's called the ivow where I'm authentically

506
00:31:52.319 --> 00:31:55.000
engaging in the experience. I'm not sitting there in the

507
00:31:55.039 --> 00:31:57.599
seat of the expert, as if I know the answers

508
00:31:57.640 --> 00:31:59.319
and the way through all of this, I'm just walking

509
00:31:59.400 --> 00:32:00.480
through it with my clients.

510
00:32:01.640 --> 00:32:01.920
And so.

511
00:32:03.480 --> 00:32:06.720
When a client is truly ready, if they arrive to

512
00:32:06.880 --> 00:32:11.759
a place in their lineage where somebody in their ancestral

513
00:32:11.839 --> 00:32:15.200
lineage caused a lot of harm and was like the

514
00:32:15.279 --> 00:32:19.119
inflictor of the trauma, there's an opportunity for them if

515
00:32:19.160 --> 00:32:22.240
they want to have it, to complete the unfinished business

516
00:32:22.319 --> 00:32:26.440
that's living in their DNA, and we collaborate to find

517
00:32:26.480 --> 00:32:29.680
our way through together, to find to find the resolution

518
00:32:29.880 --> 00:32:34.160
that feels the most peaceful, compassionate and healing for them

519
00:32:34.200 --> 00:32:34.759
in that moment.

520
00:32:35.799 --> 00:32:37.640
Well, and you know, as you were talking, what came

521
00:32:37.680 --> 00:32:40.640
to my mind and I'm smiling about this is I

522
00:32:40.759 --> 00:32:43.519
think about the difference of sitting opposite each other in

523
00:32:43.599 --> 00:32:46.519
a chair and trying to go through all this stuff

524
00:32:47.079 --> 00:32:51.559
versus standing up, taking their hand as a therapist and

525
00:32:51.720 --> 00:32:54.960
going on a walk and being with them on that journey.

526
00:32:55.160 --> 00:32:58.559
And to me, that is such a different way of

527
00:32:58.759 --> 00:32:59.440
helping people.

528
00:33:00.039 --> 00:33:02.519
It's magic. I get the chills even when you say it,

529
00:33:02.599 --> 00:33:03.119
doctor Doug.

530
00:33:03.200 --> 00:33:03.759
It's magic.

531
00:33:03.880 --> 00:33:07.039
It's like every single day I've I've been doing this

532
00:33:07.160 --> 00:33:10.920
for almost twenty years as a clinician, every single day,

533
00:33:11.000 --> 00:33:13.440
no matter how long I've worked with a client. It

534
00:33:13.599 --> 00:33:16.880
is it is just pure magic, Like I never know

535
00:33:16.960 --> 00:33:21.039
what's going to happen, whoever they are, whoever they're evolving into.

536
00:33:21.200 --> 00:33:23.319
In that moment, we get to discover together and I

537
00:33:23.400 --> 00:33:26.319
walk walk with them on that journey. It's it's a

538
00:33:26.480 --> 00:33:27.039
true honor.

539
00:33:28.079 --> 00:33:30.680
Well, and the other question that I was going to

540
00:33:30.839 --> 00:33:32.759
and I was talking about my dad, how he had

541
00:33:32.920 --> 00:33:36.480
some physical abuse. I think my grandpa which I never knew,

542
00:33:36.519 --> 00:33:38.839
he was passed away before I was born, you know,

543
00:33:38.960 --> 00:33:41.440
literally took a belt to him occasionally, and I look

544
00:33:41.480 --> 00:33:45.359
at that He's Norwegian. And as we do our genealogy,

545
00:33:46.119 --> 00:33:48.200
we go back to the Red we go we go

546
00:33:48.440 --> 00:33:51.319
back to Leprickson, we go back to you know, those

547
00:33:51.440 --> 00:33:54.920
vikings that were just you know, in some cases brutal

548
00:33:56.119 --> 00:33:59.480
and you know, but what comes to my mind when

549
00:33:59.519 --> 00:34:02.359
we start to talk about epigenetics, and I think this

550
00:34:02.559 --> 00:34:05.759
is this is an interesting factor that you know, as

551
00:34:05.839 --> 00:34:08.840
we're seeking to really overcome and a lot of times

552
00:34:09.079 --> 00:34:13.039
the fear of doing that is greater than the desire

553
00:34:13.119 --> 00:34:16.159
to do it. And therefore we stop doing that. But

554
00:34:16.360 --> 00:34:21.000
I think that if there's a reason that becomes stronger

555
00:34:21.280 --> 00:34:24.800
than the fear, that suddenly there may be a chance

556
00:34:24.920 --> 00:34:27.480
for us to move forward. And I'd love for you

557
00:34:27.599 --> 00:34:33.119
to talk about what happens epigenetically, if literally we are

558
00:34:33.239 --> 00:34:41.280
able to recognize those past things and inclinations and change

559
00:34:41.360 --> 00:34:45.960
that what happens to future generations. So for example, you know,

560
00:34:46.639 --> 00:34:51.840
my dad never touched us, We never got spanked, and

561
00:34:52.880 --> 00:34:56.239
I've seen that now with my family and my brothers

562
00:34:56.320 --> 00:35:01.440
and sisters family, that there is no abuse, physical abuse

563
00:35:01.480 --> 00:35:04.199
at all. There's just very gentle caring and so forth

564
00:35:04.199 --> 00:35:05.840
from you know, maybe once in a while with spanking,

565
00:35:05.960 --> 00:35:09.280
but that doesn't exist. And I really believe that my

566
00:35:09.519 --> 00:35:16.440
dad changed that epigenetic situation for future generations. So what's

567
00:35:16.480 --> 00:35:19.039
your experience with that, and how do you think that

568
00:35:19.119 --> 00:35:22.599
would help people to understand that they literally can change

569
00:35:22.639 --> 00:35:28.840
for future generations and empower future generations from not having

570
00:35:28.880 --> 00:35:30.599
the experiences that maybe they had.

571
00:35:31.960 --> 00:35:34.360
That's such a beautiful story that you shared. Thank you

572
00:35:35.000 --> 00:35:38.320
really for sharing it. As I'm listening to you, the

573
00:35:38.400 --> 00:35:40.920
first thing I want to say is that when we're

574
00:35:40.960 --> 00:35:44.760
able to humanize the person who was the perpetrator in

575
00:35:44.880 --> 00:35:49.079
that so the person who originally harmed their child like

576
00:35:49.199 --> 00:35:52.000
way back in the lineage, and we can see what

577
00:35:52.880 --> 00:35:56.840
circumstances caused that person to act in that way, and

578
00:35:56.960 --> 00:36:01.440
go deeper and deeper into the humanity of our ancestor,

579
00:36:02.159 --> 00:36:06.119
we can begin to humanize our own experience even more

580
00:36:07.159 --> 00:36:13.039
and really be with ourselves and our ancestors with deep compassion,

581
00:36:14.960 --> 00:36:19.280
which is healing in and of itself. I mean truly compassion.

582
00:36:19.800 --> 00:36:23.400
It can be more healing than my words could even

583
00:36:23.519 --> 00:36:27.960
begin to describe. And then from there, when we become

584
00:36:28.039 --> 00:36:31.519
the catalyst for the new pathway, for the new way

585
00:36:31.599 --> 00:36:36.360
of being, the healing, the ripple of healing that happens

586
00:36:36.519 --> 00:36:41.840
through not only our offspring but also the like our

587
00:36:42.000 --> 00:36:45.239
cousins and our cousins children like it really does start

588
00:36:45.280 --> 00:36:50.639
spreading through through the DNA, and the healing that happens

589
00:36:51.960 --> 00:36:53.199
really creates health.

590
00:36:53.760 --> 00:36:53.920
You know.

591
00:36:54.320 --> 00:36:57.800
To simply to simply say it is that there's more

592
00:36:57.880 --> 00:37:01.920
health in the system and less disease, there's more happiness

593
00:37:02.559 --> 00:37:05.639
and joy and less cruelty and violence.

594
00:37:06.880 --> 00:37:10.119
Well, and as you're in that transcendental state, do you

595
00:37:10.239 --> 00:37:12.199
find and you mentioned it, do you find that being

596
00:37:12.239 --> 00:37:15.719
able to recognize that and say, for instance, if I

597
00:37:15.800 --> 00:37:18.400
were to get into that point of still, you know,

598
00:37:18.559 --> 00:37:21.079
having a challenge with my grandfather what he was doing,

599
00:37:21.880 --> 00:37:24.719
if I can get to the point where I am

600
00:37:24.800 --> 00:37:28.800
able to forgive him and to let him know I

601
00:37:29.039 --> 00:37:32.199
love him, does that make a difference.

602
00:37:34.000 --> 00:37:37.159
I think so. I mean, I've seen it with my

603
00:37:37.280 --> 00:37:40.480
clients when it comes from a genuine place. You know,

604
00:37:40.559 --> 00:37:44.559
there's there's a difference between like a spiritual bypassing thinking

605
00:37:44.639 --> 00:37:49.119
I need to be forgiving and a genuine compassionate like

606
00:37:49.360 --> 00:37:53.000
seeing the circumstances and the suffering that he was enduring

607
00:37:53.719 --> 00:37:58.039
that caused him to act in such violent ways, to

608
00:37:58.639 --> 00:38:02.480
arrive at compassion and then to allow forgiveness and love

609
00:38:02.599 --> 00:38:03.760
to emerge naturally.

610
00:38:04.079 --> 00:38:09.639
That is healing, absolutely, and that literally changes our consciousness

611
00:38:09.960 --> 00:38:12.880
and our experience. That's amazing.

612
00:38:13.280 --> 00:38:17.599
It's an amazing We're human beings are amazing, infinitely amazing.

613
00:38:19.119 --> 00:38:23.360
So the other thing that you mentioned is how relationships

614
00:38:23.440 --> 00:38:26.719
with people, and we talked about intimacy, and you know,

615
00:38:26.840 --> 00:38:30.119
that's a broad term. So many people think it's just

616
00:38:30.199 --> 00:38:33.119
one thing, but that's really a broad term of how

617
00:38:33.199 --> 00:38:36.440
we relate to people, how we connect with people. How

618
00:38:36.519 --> 00:38:40.400
does this help in those relationships when we think about

619
00:38:40.519 --> 00:38:42.360
intimacy in all the elements.

620
00:38:43.960 --> 00:38:47.119
Yeah, so we are social beings. We are designed to

621
00:38:47.280 --> 00:38:50.000
want to be around other people, and we're designed to

622
00:38:50.079 --> 00:38:55.159
want connection and to experience, you know, love and attunement

623
00:38:55.400 --> 00:39:00.199
and compassion and to give it to others. And when

624
00:39:00.239 --> 00:39:04.360
we are stuck in these old patterns that we harm

625
00:39:04.440 --> 00:39:09.199
ourselves or we harm other people that like, the longing

626
00:39:09.559 --> 00:39:13.440
for that connection is left unsatisfied. And so when we

627
00:39:13.639 --> 00:39:16.800
start doing this deeper work and we repair our lineage

628
00:39:16.880 --> 00:39:20.039
and we start becoming a secure base for ourselves, learn

629
00:39:20.119 --> 00:39:22.559
how to regulate our nervous system, how to be present

630
00:39:22.639 --> 00:39:26.920
for contact that longing that we have for that deep,

631
00:39:27.119 --> 00:39:31.199
deep connection, whether it's emotional intimacy with a lover or

632
00:39:31.239 --> 00:39:36.480
a partner or a friend, our parent. I've actually repaired

633
00:39:36.559 --> 00:39:40.119
and healed my relationship with my father in the most profound,

634
00:39:40.159 --> 00:39:43.559
beautiful way. That affects every relationship that I have in

635
00:39:43.679 --> 00:39:49.239
my life. And when we're able to have that longing

636
00:39:49.320 --> 00:39:55.199
and connection, we actually state more aligned. When we are

637
00:39:55.320 --> 00:40:00.320
in the dysfunction, we're off center and we are more started,

638
00:40:00.679 --> 00:40:04.679
we're more twisted up in ourselves and those relationships cause

639
00:40:04.760 --> 00:40:08.119
more entanglement and more suffering. But the opposite is true

640
00:40:08.320 --> 00:40:12.840
also when we have the healthy, clean, beautiful, loving connections,

641
00:40:13.480 --> 00:40:16.039
the core of our being is actually strengthened and we

642
00:40:16.679 --> 00:40:19.840
stay more connected to ourselves for having had this intimacy.

643
00:40:20.280 --> 00:40:22.719
It's a truly sacred spiritual experience.

644
00:40:23.679 --> 00:40:25.559
Well, and you know, I think for a lot of

645
00:40:25.639 --> 00:40:29.440
people that are experiencing challenges in their personal relationships with

646
00:40:29.519 --> 00:40:33.440
their significant other, you know, how does this help them

647
00:40:33.639 --> 00:40:33.880
with that?

648
00:40:37.599 --> 00:40:41.360
How is changing the epigenetics help with with the challenges?

649
00:40:41.440 --> 00:40:44.960
Is that the question, well, how does this whole aspect

650
00:40:45.159 --> 00:40:48.320
of you know, what you do help them in those

651
00:40:48.400 --> 00:40:51.840
relationships with others? You know, you talk You talked about

652
00:40:51.880 --> 00:40:54.159
your father and how you were able to repair that.

653
00:40:54.440 --> 00:40:56.400
But you know, I guess it's on my mind. I

654
00:40:56.480 --> 00:40:58.519
had a friend call me who's really struggling in his

655
00:40:58.679 --> 00:41:01.719
marriage right now, and it's really a challenge of what's

656
00:41:01.800 --> 00:41:06.000
going on? Does how can this help these individuals to

657
00:41:06.199 --> 00:41:10.679
really develop a much better relationship if both parties are

658
00:41:10.760 --> 00:41:12.039
willing to focus on that.

659
00:41:13.239 --> 00:41:17.000
That last part is an important caveat if both parties

660
00:41:17.280 --> 00:41:21.199
are willing to engage. So I really believe that the

661
00:41:21.320 --> 00:41:23.679
work is not about whether we stay or go in

662
00:41:23.760 --> 00:41:27.079
a relationship. It's about who we become. And so, just

663
00:41:27.199 --> 00:41:29.679
like that quote that I shared earlier by Fritz Pearls,

664
00:41:30.039 --> 00:41:32.800
if I'm really looking in the mirror of relationship and

665
00:41:33.000 --> 00:41:36.639
seeing what is happening within myself, what am I trying

666
00:41:36.719 --> 00:41:38.840
to get from my partner that I think I lack

667
00:41:38.920 --> 00:41:41.559
in myself, Or what am I projecting onto my partner

668
00:41:41.679 --> 00:41:44.639
that I'm actually disowning and not feeling within myself? Like

669
00:41:44.960 --> 00:41:47.800
these are the beautiful ways that relationship can help us

670
00:41:48.320 --> 00:41:51.119
deepen into contact with ourselves, if we're willing to look,

671
00:41:51.599 --> 00:41:55.000
if we're willing to stop our stories, check our stories,

672
00:41:55.239 --> 00:41:57.639
and come back home as opposed to stay looping in

673
00:41:57.719 --> 00:42:02.199
our story about our partner. The thing with communication in

674
00:42:02.280 --> 00:42:05.960
particular is that speaking from the true self is a

675
00:42:06.039 --> 00:42:11.639
new habit. So when we are habitually trained in society

676
00:42:11.760 --> 00:42:17.639
to speak from our condition self, to use language that

677
00:42:18.000 --> 00:42:22.679
disowns our experience, like you make me so mad. That's

678
00:42:22.800 --> 00:42:26.199
just something I hear quite often that has so much

679
00:42:26.800 --> 00:42:31.960
hooks and entanglement embedded in it. If we're using language

680
00:42:31.960 --> 00:42:35.199
from our condition self, it's an indicator that we aren't

681
00:42:35.239 --> 00:42:38.480
truly connected, we're still in a projection, or we're still

682
00:42:38.679 --> 00:42:42.639
in an interjection, or we're not in full contact. And

683
00:42:42.840 --> 00:42:46.320
so if we're willing to look and see why, like

684
00:42:46.480 --> 00:42:50.559
why am I assigning my feelings to that person, blaming

685
00:42:50.679 --> 00:42:53.000
them for how I feel as opposed to taking full

686
00:42:53.039 --> 00:42:56.920
ownership as an emotionally mature, self responsible adult for the

687
00:42:56.960 --> 00:42:59.360
way that I feel and then making a decision about

688
00:42:59.400 --> 00:43:01.559
how I want to be here, Like it takes a

689
00:43:01.599 --> 00:43:09.400
lot of awareness and continual looking within, and it's beautiful work.

690
00:43:09.760 --> 00:43:13.159
Like when we're truly committed to looking in the mirror

691
00:43:13.239 --> 00:43:17.840
of relationship, the depth that we can find both within

692
00:43:17.880 --> 00:43:21.400
ourselves and an intimacy is it's so much more beautiful

693
00:43:21.480 --> 00:43:24.199
than any of the narratives that the mind can put

694
00:43:24.320 --> 00:43:27.639
onto relationship or any fantasy that we think relationship might be.

695
00:43:27.880 --> 00:43:33.000
Like the true experience is it's pure magic. And I

696
00:43:33.119 --> 00:43:36.719
will say that in my own personal life, like having

697
00:43:36.880 --> 00:43:40.199
overcome the patterns that I have overcome in my life

698
00:43:40.719 --> 00:43:45.679
and arriving into a marriage that is beyond what my

699
00:43:45.840 --> 00:43:49.519
mind could have ever conceived of that where he's such

700
00:43:49.559 --> 00:43:52.760
a reflection of my integrated wholeness as opposed to my wounding.

701
00:43:54.239 --> 00:43:56.360
I mean, I'm so grateful for having done the work.

702
00:43:57.599 --> 00:44:01.079
Yes, yes, amen to that. Yes, Oh my goodness. You

703
00:44:01.159 --> 00:44:07.360
know what, we come to the clothes. Time goes by

704
00:44:07.800 --> 00:44:11.480
so quickly sometimes, but you know, as we get to

705
00:44:11.599 --> 00:44:15.280
the clothes, if you could just you know, put in

706
00:44:15.400 --> 00:44:18.760
a very short moment a message that you'd like to

707
00:44:18.800 --> 00:44:20.559
share with the audience, what would that be.

708
00:44:23.039 --> 00:44:27.639
I would like people to recognize that to do personal

709
00:44:27.719 --> 00:44:31.480
growth work is deeply humbling any part of our ego

710
00:44:31.679 --> 00:44:36.000
that thinks that we are special or above other people,

711
00:44:36.480 --> 00:44:41.760
like really really pulls us away from doing our deep work.

712
00:44:41.840 --> 00:44:47.480
And so by humbly looking at ourselves and finding our

713
00:44:47.559 --> 00:44:51.400
way back to our true nature, the joy and the

714
00:44:51.599 --> 00:44:56.119
love and the connection to all of humanity that can

715
00:44:56.199 --> 00:45:01.559
arise from that place is is so it's just so

716
00:45:01.679 --> 00:45:04.519
beautiful and so embodied, like with our feet on the ground,

717
00:45:04.679 --> 00:45:09.000
humbly standing our sacred ground and opening our heart to

718
00:45:09.679 --> 00:45:10.960
what life wants to unfold.

719
00:45:11.960 --> 00:45:14.840
Oh, thank you for that. Thank you. So. How do

720
00:45:14.920 --> 00:45:15.800
people find your book?

721
00:45:17.199 --> 00:45:20.239
My book is on Amazon. Yeah, Align, Living and Loving

722
00:45:20.320 --> 00:45:23.119
from the True Self. There's also links on my website

723
00:45:23.199 --> 00:45:26.840
which are My website is the spiritually Aligned dot.

724
00:45:26.800 --> 00:45:33.639
Com Okay, so website Amazon, and then when they go

725
00:45:33.719 --> 00:45:35.559
to your website, are they actually able to get in

726
00:45:35.639 --> 00:45:38.320
touch with you if they so desire. Yeah.

727
00:45:38.400 --> 00:45:40.760
Absolutely. I have a lot of courses on my website

728
00:45:40.840 --> 00:45:44.960
for spiritually aligned relationships and also for therapists who are

729
00:45:45.000 --> 00:45:46.559
committed to awakening.

730
00:45:47.639 --> 00:45:50.480
Wonderful harmony. Thank you so much. This is this has

731
00:45:50.559 --> 00:45:53.440
been This has been wonderful. I appreciate it, and I

732
00:45:53.559 --> 00:45:56.679
appreciate everything that you're doing. I find that you know,

733
00:45:56.760 --> 00:46:01.360
as people truly seek to develop that in herself, that

734
00:46:01.800 --> 00:46:04.559
all of a sudden, the next step is to empower others,

735
00:46:04.639 --> 00:46:09.000
and that's what you're doing. So kudos to you. Thank

736
00:46:09.039 --> 00:46:09.559
you so much.

737
00:46:09.639 --> 00:46:11.639
Thanks for having me you Bett.

738
00:46:11.480 --> 00:46:13.440
And folks, thanks for listening. I hope this has been

739
00:46:13.519 --> 00:46:16.119
meaningful for you. Look forward to having you join us

740
00:46:16.159 --> 00:46:19.159
again soon. This is doctor B saying no mistay