“A Creative Path to Your Hidden Superpowers and True Calling”

0:01 This program is designed to provide general information with regards to the subject matters covered. This information is given with the understanding that neither the hosts, guests, sponsors, or station are engaged in rendering any specific and personal medical, financial, legal counseling, professional service, or any advice. You should seek the services of competent professionals before applying or trying any suggested ideas. At the end of the day, it's not about what you have or even what you've accomplished. It's about what you've done with those accomplishments. It's about who you've lifted up, who you've made better. It's about what you've given back Thanzel Washington, Welcome to Inspire Vision. Our sole purpose is to elevate the lives of others and to inspire you to do the same. Michelle, Welcome to the show. How are you. I'm good. Thank you so much for having me. I'm excited to be here. Oh I'm really excited for this.

1:02 I think it's going to be a lot of fun. So, now where you located? I am in Portland, Oregon. Oh my goodness. Okay, so let's have you tell the audience a little bit about yourself. What I find interesting is the stories that bring people to the point where they are when we're doing the podcast. So I'd love for you to share with the audience your story. Once upon a time, I'm just having fun. I got my doctorate in cognitive psychology at Princeton University, and I went on to become a psychology professor. But I kept feeling like something was missing. I just couldn't quite put my finger on what it was. And as time went by, I discovered that I could sing. I discovered that I could write songs. I discovered that I wasn't bad on the guitar, and I realized that I wanted to be a rock and roll star. I wanted to be a musician, a professional musician. I wanted to make that leap. So a few people I was at Santa Clara University at the time, a few people thought I was crazy. But I did it, and I did get a record deal, and it just made me think that people like me don't know what all of their gifts are, what all of their strengths and talents are. And so after I had a career as a musician, one day

2:35 I had a DJ asked me, Hey, do you think you'll ever go back to teaching, And I'm like, no, I'm a rock star, why would I want to do that? But then I realized I really did want to go back to teaching, because if I could find a gift I didn't know I had, maybe I'm a good teacher. Maybe I could help other people find gifts that they don't know they have. So I started teaching workshops and I've been doing it for twenty years. Wow, that's fantastic, you know, And it's so interesting that, you know, as you said, teaching my daughter. My twenty six year old daughter actually was heading towards a PhD in sociology research and she hit the masters, got her masters, and then it's like I get this call that dad, I'm not sure I want to continue, And it's like, you know, what good for you?

3:25 Take your time to go out and do something, and you know you can always go back. But if you spend another three to four years working on that PhD and then you find you don't like it, you've lost four to five years. So it's fascinating how people do that. And you know, what's interesting to me is how many people are actually doing something that they think they should be doing. And you know what, at least based on some of my research, and you're going to have a lot more information on this. What are the physical effects, what are the health effects, what are the mental effects? For someone who has been told this is what you need to do and so they end up following that advice and then find themselves five years, ten years, twenty years in that profession. I think the number one thing that people will feel is not alive anymore. They won't have energy anymore. I mean, they can develop all kinds of little problems like carpal tunnel and you know, shoulder issues. If they have tech jobs or they're in front of a computer a lot and it's not something that's they're calling, they're more likely to have little illnesses like that creep up. But I would say the number one thing that happens is that your life force just sort of drains out of you. You can it causes depression, anxiety, and just sort of a little bit of deadness in the heart. You know, well, and you know it's it's interesting. I mean, I come from

4:59 a fan only have five boys, right, and my dad was the university professor taught actually you loved us. He taught classical music. He was a voice teacher and yeah, yeah the internet and nationally known one. But anyway, it's interesting because he told each one of us, you will get an advanced degree, and I'm not paying for it. My dad didn't pay for my degree either, so it was it was really interesting. Older brother Harvard business. Uh, you know, a couple of attorneys, me and dentists and so on and so forth. One brother did not do it. He did not go to college, and I think that he experienced a lot of difficulty with my dad because my dad was really not happy with that. Of course, the guess who's the most I guess who is the one that, yeah, financially is has done the best? Seriously, Yeah, serious, seriously. And and so it's so interesting that, you know, we get pushed to do something and we do that. And you know, do I know whether my brothers were happy or not. I can't tell you. Was I happy doing dentistry. I enjoyed it for quite a while, but ultimately some physical issues came up. And as I look back on that, it's like, Wow, that is just amazing how that can happen. Yeah,

6:32 I think the body starts to shut down you know, we're we occupy bodies, we're spirits in bodies, and if we're not on course, if we're not on our path, our bodies will let us know. So what happens? Why why do we not really from the get go understand what our passion is and what our gifts are? Yeah, thank you for asking that question, because that's sort of what I've been devoting my whole life to trying to understand. So I've been teaching these workshops for over twenty years and I've had so many thousands of clients now, and I've noticed that no two people are alike, and not even twins. I think that people come in with a unique purpose and unique gifts to you know, use to follow that purpose.

7:19 But as soon as we come into this world, there's a lot of rules, and we're surrounded by different sorts of tribes, groups of people that we belong to. Number one, the family, and often the family that you're in does not see your gifts, or they see them, they don't understand them, or they might ignore them, they don't notice them. And then the next tribe that we're in our schools, and a lot of times teachers don't recognize our gifts, or they might even shame us for a guests because we're not doing what they expect. And then there's the culture that we live in. So I can give you an example. You know, when I was growing up, I had a gift for playing soccer, but I grew up at a time when girls were not allowed to play soccer, so I never got to use that gift. So we come in with these unique gifts, but the world tells us to conform, conform, be like everybody else, And so if a gift isn't recognized or if it's shamed, we sort of take that gift and we stuff it way deep inside, deep into the unconscious, and we forget all about it, although it's sort of there trying to get our attention the whole time, but it's sort of a protection mechanism.

8:31 But the problem is is you start to go through life and you start to feel empty, you start to feel like something's missing, like I did, you know when I was a professor. So I think it's mostly that power of the society around us telling us to conform, to be like everyone else, to do what we're supposed to do, Like your father wanting everybody to go to school and get a degree. That happens a lot. Yeah. Oh yeah, Well, and you mentioned one thing that I'm very cognizant of right now. You talk about how children, as young people can be shamed because of the gifts that they have, and not only by family, but by teachers. And you know, I'm very I've been doing a few podcasts about bullying and that's not where we're going to go today. But just as a brief thought and comment, what do parents? Number one? What would you advise parents as far as as they're raising their children, How can they help their children to discover their gifts rather than shame them? Number one?

9:37 And then number two, what's your comments about teachers that are shaming their students. Well, I used to be a teacher, so I tried really hard not to do that. I think for parents, and you know, granted, parents are so busy and they've got so much they're trying to do, but really, what my number one recommendation is is just to slow down and watch your child. Just watch your child, pay attention to what they're doing, pay attention to what draws them. There's a very good chance it's going to fall outside the expectations that you have for that child. You know, you did a wonderful job of bringing a human being into the world, and I just thank you for that. But that human being has its own purpose and it has its own gifts, he or she or you know, and to give them permission to discover who they are and to support that.

10:31 And for as far as teachers are concerned, I you know, when I taught at Santa Clair University, for example, I remember once I went into a room where the teachers hung out, professors hung out, and I could tell that there was one professor there who was going to deliberately give one of his students a bad grade because he didn't like the way he did something. It wasn't it just wasn't what he thought was the right way to do it, and he wanted to punish him. And there's no need for that. There's no need for that. There's so many different ways to express writing, for example, whatever field you want to go into, there's so many different ways to do that, and to allow students to have their own unique take on it. Yeah, that's what I would say. And I always tried to stay out of my students' ways. In fact, I would try to help them figure out what it was that they wanted to do. They would often come to my office hours. I had so many of my students come to my office hours, it was amazing asking for advice about what they should do. And I always said, follow your heart, you know, just follow your heart, and that often took them in a very very good direction.

11:46 But it's not what other professors were telling them. Well, and you know, as interesting as you talk about parents, and you know expectations, how do you help a parent? Okay, how do you help a parent to recognize excuse me, that they have expectations that may have been forced on them by their parents or by society or whatever. How do you help a parent to actually recognize that? Okay, you know what, I do not have to put my expectations on my child. I need to allow them to discover their own guests. How do you help a parent to do that? I just love that you even asked that question. I think that just that question is halfway there, just to even know that that's what's going on.

12:33 To raise awareness that you might unconsciously be putting expectations onto your child without knowing it, you will know what you need to do is try to see what the signs are. So it'll be a contraction in the stomach, it'll be a tightening in the jaw, it will be a shaking of the head. It will be a you'll say no somehow to something that your child is doing. And to step back and examine that no. Where is that no coming from? And maybe can you just you don't even have to figure it out in the moment, just relax it a little bit and look at your child again and just see if you can observe them with a sort of you know, in a sort of a not a detached to way that's not exactly the way I want to put it, but just neutral, a neutral stance, like pretend they're not your child for a moment and just watch them and see what they do. You might be able to pick up on something that you haven't seen before. Yes, and how many? I mean, as you look at what you've done and the people that you've worked with, what would you say is the percentage? And there is an unfair question, but really what's the percentage of those that know their gift from the beginning and follow that versus those of us that end up in some type of profession or some type of work of some sort that really it's not their gift. It's very interesting you should ask, and I hope it's okay to mention that. I also

14:05 have a podcast and I interview people who knew those gifts so they found their calling, and I work with clients who didn't know those gifts and so they didn't know what their calling was. And you know, the interesting thing about both of them, both of them, both sets of people had gifts early on. The difference was the people who knew their gifts were supported. They were supported by their families, somebody and their family saw it, a teacher encouraged them. Only takes one person, even where they just happened to fit in a culture that supported what they do. Naturally. The people that I work with who didn't remember their gifts because the gifts were there, were not supported, so they stuffed them down. They forgot who they were, and then they just started listening to what the world told them to be. That is the chief difference. Everybody's got those gifts from the get go. Well, and you know, it was fascinating. I think that sometimes it can be very dramatic. I remember and I've shared the story before, but you know, I had my dentists in dental practice for twenty one years, and then ultimately there was some physical issues that didn't allow me to do that anymore.

15:16 Went back to business school and was, you know, decided I was going to do some coaching and helping people with small businesses. And I was enjoying that. My dad passed away in twenty ten, and I remember that he had taught at Northwestern University in Evanston, Illinois, and they decided to have a memorial concert for him, and so they invited us all, you know, they asked permission. Of course, we gave it, and so we all went back and they brought all of the you know, as many as could the singers that were out doing operas and everything, both internationally as well as nationally, and talking about stories about my dad and so on and so forth, and then and some singing. And I walked out of there and I looked at my brothers and my little sister, and you know, I thought, you know, did you really get what? Did you hear what I heard today? And you know, they're looking at me strange, and it's like, you know, here was the story that I got at that memorial concert from hearing everyone speak as well as singing number one. Yeah, Norman. He was an amazing voice teacher. But what he really did for us was teach us to when he gave us the strength and the ability to win, to love, to live. And that's what changed me.

16:47 And all of a sudden, I thought, you know what, here's my dad, who's a great who was a great voice teacher. But on the side he affected his students in a much more powerful way. In fact, one student told the story about how they used to play tennis, which was weird because there's years and years apart, but they were friends and how every once in a while my dad would win when he was playing in the seventies, right, And he says, I could never figure it out and finally understood he had willed me off the court. And then he shares a story about how he was over in Germany and was auditioning for a particular opera, coming against the top German tenor, and he tells the story about how he just worked hard and you know, practiced whatever song everybody knew that you have to do, and he says, when it was all finished, not only did I get that one, but I got the entire season, And he says, as I walked off the stage, I thought, what on earth?

17:52 And then it hit me I had willed them off the stage. Thank you, Norman for teaching me that. Wow. And I think that when I heard these stories, it was like, you know what, Yeah, I'm doing this, I'm doing that. I'm helping people. But ultimately I need to be able to make a difference in people's lives. I need to do something that allows me, whether it's directly or on the side, to be able to help people. And I think that's part of what motivated me to start doing this podcast. And obviously for you it's a similar thing. So do you find that sometimes people have these amazing aha moments to where they realize that, you know what, this is my purpose? Oh? Absolutely.

18:41 I see it all the time. In my workshops. I see the light go on in somebody's eyes. In my case, I often see it with respect to discovering a gift that they didn't know they had. So the light will go off and they'll realize, oh my god, I can paint. I didn't know I could paint, you know. Or I had a woman who was eighty four years old who learned that she could dance. That's and she could do it still because she had the ability. But absolutely, I think it happens all the time. And also, are you familiar with Carl Jungian psychology Jungian analysis at all. Well, I don't think I am, but maybe as you explain it, and maybe I just wanted to yeah, just with respect with what you said. According to a lot of Yunian analysts, we have sort of a couple of stages in our life. In the first stage is where you sort of dutiful lee get a job, you raise your children. You know, you check the boxes, you do what you should. But in the second half of life, something deeper starts calling to you your purpose, really something, yourself, your true self, your authentic self, what you came here to do. It starts calling you because you've done that sort of work to you know, check the boxes in the first half of life. But now in the second half of life, it pulls you in deeper. And I think a lot of times, like as you're explaining, it's happened to me too, I just want to give back even more, you know, while I'm still here, I hear you,

20:11 I'm exactly the same way. And and you know what I think a lot of people don't even realize is that when you do start doing that, it fills you with so much joy and energy. You know, you think you're being selfless, but you get something from it too, just you know, like a side dish. Well, and it's interesting what you went through because you found your gift of seeing and and you know, in writing music and so forth, and then all of a sudden you've found another purpose now and you have moved on to a different purpose. So do you find that oftentimes for people's lives that they and it kind of goes about what you were talking about with a psychology account concept that they have multiple purposes and just as we move forward in life, we discover new ones. Yes, well some people do. I think some people. It's different for different people. Some people do have a strong calling that they do their whole life, but many people, we have many gifts, and I think at different stages of our lives, different gifts all at us. Also, I like to refer to gifts as superpowers because it, you know, it makes people notice more like if I say, oh, you have a superpower, but I like the analogy of a superhero because if you think of Superman, for example, he doesn't just fly, he has X ray vision, he can freeze things with his breath, you know, all kinds of things like this, And likewise, human beings have lots of different gifts, and I think sometimes we're called to

21:44 do different bring different parts of ourselves to the table, depending on where we are in our lives. So yes, I think it's very normal for people to have It's like a multifaceted purpose, or I call it a constellation calling you've got more facets to it. Then you might think, well, and you know, it's interesting. As I was doing some business consulting for small businesses, every once in a while I come across someone who suddenly said, you know, discovered a gift or discovered a passion. And it's like, Okay, I'm going to I'm going to quit my job or I'm going to close my company and I'm going to go do this, and I'm going whoa slow down a minute, because I've seen people that chose to do that and then they find themselves not able to make a living and it's really a struggle.

22:36 And so what do you recommend to people is they discover a passion, as they discover a gift, what do you recommend to them when they say, Okay, I'm going to quit my job or I'm going to close my company and do this, what do you recommend to them. I think it's really important to have one foot in each world, the world that you're already stable and the world that you want to go into, to try to do it at the same time, to take this gift that you are discovering, and to do it on the side as a side project, even if you are starting to get tired of the career that you're in or it's not as fulfilling as it might be. If you engage in a passion on the side, it gives you so much energy, It gives you so much a liveness that you're able, you know, you're able to actually bring that energy back to work. And there's research that comes out of San Francisco State University that shows that people who have a creative project are they get better evaluations at work, they get promoted more at work. So you can actually gain from, you know, sort of developing your talent on the side while you keep your job and just start, I'll give you Is it okay if I tell a quick story to yes, yes, okay. So remember once I had an attorney come to one of my workshops. This was a two day workshop a

24:06 Saturday and then the next Saturday. And he he, you know, he was an attorney. He had two kids in high school and a stay at home mom wife, and he was starting to feel a little restless about being an attorney. He didn't really want to do it anymore. And something felt, you know, just like it was missing from his life. And so, of course, my first thing is to try to help people find out whatever that is. So I said to him, just I want you to just pretend that you don't have a wife and you don't have children, and you don't have to be an attorney. What would you do? And I could see like his eyebrow went up, and I'm like, no wife.

24:48 And I said, you know, it's a thought experiment. It's just a thought experiment in the air. I don't mean that you have to do it out in the world. So so he said, okay, I'll try that. And my class was a and I don't know if you're familiar with California, but it was in Santa Cruz and then he drove He lived in Monterey, so he drove down to Monterey after that class. The next week he comes in and he says, I know what it is. I know what it is. And I said, what happened? He said, I was driving through Slenas, the fields of Selenas, and all of a sudden, I just pulled over. I got out of my car and I was doing this because the fields they looked like they were being lit up from the inside. I want to be a photographer. And he also said, I remember I wanted to be a photographer when I was young. So what Dan did was he ended up and this is what I would recommend. He ended up shooting photos on the side on the weekends, on lunch breaks, after work, before the sun set, whenever he got a chance. But he did not stop being an attorney. Now you might think now I would wear him down. It didn't like I was saying before. It filled him with all of this energy, amazing amounts of energy. And after about a year he had a lot of photos put together and he invited me to come down to a showing in Monterey. He had two paint or sorry, two photos that were going to be displayed alongside professional So I went, you know, and

26:18 his wife was there and his kids were there, and one of the photos was just a beautiful sunset, Monterey sunset, and it was just so I was so happy to see him flanked by his family who were supporting him. He never gave up anything, but there he had that photo. It's sold and he started selling photographs. And so with Dan, the idea was, you know, in a few years, his kids will go through college and they'll be done. And then as he accumulates more and more photos, sells a few on the side, he can start making that business happen on the side if he wants to. And he doesn't even have to because a lot of times when we find our passion, we don't have to do it for a job. I mean, it's great if we can, but we don't have to to feel fulfilled by it. So that's what I would recommend try to do, you know, keep both worlds going for as long as you can, and then make the leap when you feel ready. Yeah, and I love to use the terms. You know, it's either both and or either or, and the truth is both and is what works. So I love that story because it's so true. And you know, oftentimes when we find that passion and we're able to do that on the side, as you say, it helps us to be better in our work, and ultimately we may find that it's a good enough balance that we don't have to make that change, that we can keep both. That's right. That's right. Well,

27:48 And you know, as you've been doing these workshops, what have you found are the key elements to someone realizing that they haven't found their purpose yet or they haven't discovered some of those gifts that should be there. You mentioned that he was not sure he wanted to do, you know, law anymore, practice law anymore? Have you found that there are some key elements that if someone were to stop for a minute and become aware of themselves, which we don't do very often, But if they were to do that, what are some of the indicators that they could be aware of that would say to them, you know what, you have another purpose, you have other gifts.

28:32 It's time to discover what they are. A lot of the people who take my workshops have had some sort of transition happen in their lives. I just want to tell you this first, and then I will definitely answer your question. But they may have lost a job, they may have gone through a divorce, they may have a sudden illness. This is a lot of times the kind of people that originally or initially come to me, So they're already in some sort of transition, and you might think that that's a horrible time to be in your life, but it's actually a window of opportunity because these people come to my workshops because they know that they're missing something. They know that something's off, something's missing, something's not right about their lives.

29:15 Clearly because things have sort of fallen apart. It's not necessarily a bad thing for things to fall apart because it gives you this huge, huge playing ground to investigate who you really are and who you might want to become once you get the courage to do that. So I just wanted to say that first. But some of the indicators that you're not following your purpose are you're agitated, you feel restless, you feel like something's off, you're jealous of other people and what they're doing. That's a really good clue if you watch somebody doing something and you find yourself being a little bit too critical about how they're doing it. It might be because you want to do that too, but you haven't admitted that yet, so you're just going to be hard on them, you know what I mean? That's a that's a good clue. What else? You start realizing that there's this dream that's been on the back burner and it seems like it's tugging at you. It starts to get in your head. It starts you start to have ideas about doing it again. Uh, something that you might have put away because a lot of times people do sort of know what they want to do, but then they lose the confidence or they don't have the opportunity to do it, and they put that dream sort of on the on the side. Uh. And that it just starts to say it tug at them and say, you know, didn't you always want to teach? Don't you like teaching? Don't you like explaining things?

30:47 You really like explaining things to people? You know, just things like that, they'll they'll just start coming to your mind, or you might even hear you know, it's almost like a gift. Might be saying just look at me, look at me. I like to sing, I like to sing in the shower, or I'm always writing things down, or you know, sometimes we're in this is kind of interesting, and you might find this interesting. Sometimes we're following we're almost following our purpose. We're kind of we're doing it, but we're in the wrong field. Like for example, there was one woman who wanted to be a writer, and she did become a tech writer in Silicon Valley, but she was feeling restless and feeling like something was off and something was missing, and she also didn't look like a tech writer.

31:34 She wore bunny slippers and she had long blonde hair, and she was in the margins. She was writing little ideas for screenplays. That's how it comes out like on the side, Like it just sneaks out, like when you're not expecting it. Your pen moves over to the side and writes an idea for a screenplay. And I encouraged her to sort of pay attention to those marginalized writings and long story shorts. She ended up writing five screenplays that got picked up by Disney, and she eventually wrote and then directed and produced her own movie. And now she lives in Hollywood. So she was almost I mean, she was a writer, but she was in the wrong field, you know what I mean. That's also sometimes what's in front of people, which is why I think it's worth taking your defenses down and just let yourself get a little soft and just let yourself really look at things, because the change that you might need to make might not even I mean, that was a big change, but honestly, she was so built for that world that it wasn't hard for her to make. You know, so often when you do find the marginalized voice in your head, that little voice that is whispering to you to do something, if you follow it, you'll find that as you know, Joseph Campbell says, doors open where there used to be walls. You know, it's true, there's some truth to that. So that's one of the ways also that you can start to see that, oh yeah, that is a path I should be on. So what you know,

33:07 as the listeners are listening and as they you know, as they stop and start to consider what are the what are the questions that they can ask themselves to really find out what their missing talents are if they're finding that they're really not satisfied and happy with the way their life is going. Yeah, So one of the I have a few questions that I like to ask people. But one of them is what comes naturally to you? It's really easy for you, and you can especially know this if you compare yourself to others. So for example, once I was getting coffee in a coffee shop and the guy that was taking my order was doing crossword puzzle and he was saying to the guy in the back, you know what's a four letter word for?

33:57 I forget what the question was, but the guy in the back goes reap, you know. It was like he just, you know, had it. It was easy for him, but not easy for the guy that was serving me coffee. It's easy for me to hear music in my head, but not easy for somebody else to hear music in their head. And I didn't figure that out for a really long time. So what just comes easily to you? Another big one is when you do the super When you you know, use the superpower, it puts you in the moment, It puts you in the now. So for example, when I write a song, uh, time disappears. A woman I was working with, she thought she was a high powered executive. She was really burning out. She wanted to find a creative outlet to sort of balance her out. And she thought she should do writing, you know, be a writer like her father.

34:47 But eventually it just didn't wasn't when she would look at the clock, it wasn't. It wasn't happening for her. And I asked her to experiment, try some other things, and she tried a few things, and eventually she tried painting, and she went up to her attic. She sort of set it up and she went up and she started painting, and hours would go by and her husband would be downstairs and making dinner for her, and she would never come down because she was just the time disappeared, and then eventually she would come down and he would heat up the meal. But that's how she discovered, Oh, painting is what it was. And then just I wanted to include that she may she did a portrait of her husband and won an award for it also, so he got back. Another thing is just like, you know, what fills you with passion or what makes you come alive. So you know, before our interview, I was just sort of thinking back to myself about some of the things I do, so I could refresh my memory, you know, so i'd be ready to talk to you.

35:45 And just as I was thinking about the people I work with and some of the stories I could tell, I just I just had so much more energy than I had a few minutes before that. So you can just notice your energy level goes up when you start to do something that's a better fit for you. And another thing is and and we were talking about it right at the beginning, what were you interested in when you were a child. And sometimes it takes a little you know, legwork, a little digging to go back there. But most of us had those gifts when we were young. And if you know, we probably got an inkling or somebody might have seen us. I remember going out with a gentleman who was in the tech world, an engineer, and I spoke to his mother once since she said, you know, he was just always taking everything apart, you know, five year years old. He's just like taking everything apart and putting it back together, you know. So sometimes a parent does notice, so they might know if you don't. And another and this is sort of points to what you were talking about doing this podcast, is what is intrinsically rewarding to you when you do it? You are fulfilled. You don't even need to be paid for it, although you know, sure it's nice to be paid for what you do, but you're just fulfilled by doing it. That's a huge indicator of what your calling is or what your gift is. That. I love that. What are some of the other stories that you've experienced with people

37:15 that where they have literally moved from one area to another area and found their passion. Well, you know, this is a story I love telling. So it was the first workshop I ever taught, and there was a police detective, a woman I'll call her Maria. She had fiery red hair, and she came into my workshop and she something wasn't quite working in her career anymore. She was only in her forties, but she felt like she had to retire early. This was in San Jose, and you know, she thought that she had to completely change what she was doing. And she had a passion and it was a real passion, and that was for traveling.

38:00 And so she thought that what she should do is write travel brochures or you know, something about traveling. She would become a travel writer. So every week she would come into my class and she would like try to be writing these travel brochures, but they were never happening, they were never coming to her. And I could tell she didn't like writing, but she had a passion for travel. I could see that that was true. And I could also see that what was true is she loved being a police detective. She loved it. This is getting to your and idea, this and that. And I said to her, Maria, why do you think you have to be a police detective or you travel? Maybe it's possible that you could do both. And she really took that in. I could see that she really took that in. And a few months later she got a job with United Nations. She went to Bosnia training the local police forced there to adopt human rights procedures. So she got to travel and she got to be a police officer, but in a much much bigger way. I just I just love that she did that. Oh that's fascinating, And you know, it's it's so interesting as we see society right now, how how much of an effect do you think not finding our passion, not really doing that which we really have the gifts to do, is affecting the overall culture right now of society

39:35 that we're experiencing, which right now is not very good. No, it's not very good. I think that's such an important question. I think it has a lot to do with what's happening right now, because if you don't find your true gifts, you start to feel angry, upset, disappointed, and you can often project that onto somebody else. It's somebody else's fault, it's not mine. But even more than that, something that I wanted to say, and something I deeply believe because I work with a lot of millennials and gen z and they're inheriting a really difficult world right and again, I've seen so many people that I've worked with find a purpose, find gifts they didn't know they have, and often when they do, they use that gift in service somehow. And I feel like we were put each of us, every single person was put on this earth. I mean, why are we all living right now, right now, in this point in time. I don't think it's an accident. I think each of us has a piece of the puzzle to help solve this. It's not like we're supposed to wait for somebody else to solve it. We're all supposed to get on board and it's my deep, deep belief that when people will just take some time to get to know themselves better and to find that gift, that they can then use that gift to bring their part to the table. You know, I'll just give you an example of something that might seem like a small gift, but it's so important. I was working with a young woman who she was unhappy.

41:09 She was a receptionist. Her boyfriend was teasing her because she had a lot of stuffed animals, and she liked to watch Beauty and the Beast over and over again, and she just you know, didn't like speaking up in class. She didn't like who she was. And one day, she you know, asked me if I thought there was something wrong with her, because you know, she was in her twenties. And I looked at her, and she had so much integrity. I just thought, no, there's I don't think there's anything wrong with you. And I said why, and she said, well, my boyfriend thinks, I, you know, I shouldn't be doing all this. He made me give all my stuffed animals away, and I said, you know, and you could see everybody in the room was like, that's not cool. And so anyway, she left her boyfriend and as and she started to find her own voice. And what we started to discover together was that she could see the world through the eyes of a child. That's what she was really good at. And her true calling was to be a kindergarten teacher. And what I and she is a fabulous one.

42:14 She's been doing it for years. And you want a kindergarten teacher like that, someone who's really right, somebody who's really into it, who is answering her true calling because she is a role model just by her essence, her energy, you know, the way she carries herself and the way she talks. She's a role model to those little kids in her class to be who they really are. So there's no gift that's too small. And I honestly believe that each of us has a responsibility to bring our own piece of the puzzle together and solve the world problems together. And can you imagine what the world would be like if each individual was able to find that gift and express in their lives, which, as you say, once you found that gift or once you've found that passion, it elevates your emotions, it elevates your whole life experience. Can you imagine? And and you know, I'd like to talk about the one you know, we keep hearing people talk about, you know, and I did this initially as I started my podcast.

43:20 So am I going to reach millions of people? Am I going to do this and that? And finally it hit me, you know, it doesn't matter. What matters is can I reach one and will make the difference in the life of one individual? And periodically, when I get, you know, a message from someone saying, hey, I just love it made such a difference to hear this podcast in my life, It's like, Okay, that's that's why I'm doing this. And can you imagine if each person as a one were to discover their gifts and to start to follow those and have that emotional elevation that would occur, what it would do to the world. World. I think we need to do this. I think, I mean and I you know what's interesting about the younger generations, because I work with them a lot, is they value authenticity, they value diversity, they value being of service. It's really really important to them. And so I feel like they're halfway there already. Their their their their values are already right online, you know what I mean. But it's just a matter of them digging in and finding out what their path is. But I think there's hope that this may happen well. And as we closes the show today, what would be take about a minute, what would be the final message that you would like to share with the audience. It's okay to feel like you're weird.

44:44 It's okay to feel like you don't belong. If you feel like you don't belong to a certain group, that you're hanging out with, a certain tribe that you may be in, it's probably an indicator that your calling is pulling you in a new direction, and it's not a bad thing. Don't freak out about it, don't worry about it. Open your heart up, find out where you're being called, and feel like I give you permission. I'm Michelle Chappel, give you permission to follow that the feeling of not belonging is often the very first step in finding your true calling. I love that, Michelle. Thank you so much for being on the show. I really appreciate it. Well, thank you for having me. Hey, what tremendous insights you've shared. And so how do folks find you, you know, if they if they are finding that, you know, I need some help.

45:37 How can they find you? I have a website called be your Own Superhero, which is all about finding your unique superpowers. So be your Own Superhero dot com. I also have a podcast you're called Your True Calling Find your Hidden Superpowers. So those are two good ways to find me. And your podcast is on most of the podcasts. Yeah, it's on Apple and Google and iHeartRadio and yeah, exactly. Yeah, I really enjoyed. I enjoyed you. Thank you so much, well, and thank you and folks, thanks for thanks for listening. And I hope this has made a difference in your lives as you consider what is your purpose, what are your gifts?

46:21 And you know what, as Michelle was saying, we encourage you to discover what those are because it's going to make a difference in your life. Enjoy, enjoy the week or the rest of the week, and hope that you'll join us again soon